Borrowed Trust: The Key to Podcast Guesting? | RR379

Hi everyone, and welcome to this week's episode

of Relationships Rule. Podcast guesting gets treated like a

checkbox a lot of the time. Show up, hit record, hope for the

best. Well, my guest today, Kristen Nolan, sees it

differently as a podcast guest strategist at Interview Valet,

she helps business leaders and C-suite executives turn guest

appearances into real relationships-the kind that open

doors long after the interview ends. Today, we're talking about

what it actually takes to build trust with a host, connect with

an audience, and make podcast guesting a relationship strategy

instead of a one-time visibility play. I love that, and thank

you, and welcome to the show, Kristen.

Awesome, thank you so much, Janice, for having

me.

You're welcome. I mean, I think it's important to

say upfront that, as is visible for those on YouTube to remind

us that Kristen works for Interview Valet, and I think I

have to say that Interview Valet actually I'm going to do the

plug because they are the most professional podcast guesting

company that I've ever worked with, and and the standards are

high. And I, if I get a guest that comes to me that's been

pitched to me by Interview Valet, I always look at them,

and I always know that they'll be high quality. So it's kind of

you know, what is what does you can tell us a little bit about

your path to becoming a podcast guest strategist? What drew you

to this work? And but what does this role look like? Do you

coach the guests? Give me a little bit.

Yeah, absolutely. So thank you so much for the

kind words about Interview Valet. We like to do things a

little differently than everyone else. So for us, pitch is like a

four-letter word, right? We don't want to pitch a guest; we

want to pitch a ball. So we talk about it from the stance of an

introduction. So when we are introducing people to you, we

are not looking at it as I'm pitching you someone to be on

your podcast. We are introducing you and opening a door for both

you as the host and the guest to have that relationship. So

that's really the one the one thing that I I like to emphasize

is that you know we we want to go beyond the transactional and

really into the into the relationship piece of it because

if you're thinking about it, a lot of the guests right they're

gonna they're gonna know people that could be potential clients

or potential centers of influence that could also become

referral partners. So if you're looking at it from a lens of I'm

just gonna show up, record, and kind of hope for the best,

that's a very transactional way to look at it. Whereas I am

consistently coaching my clients, you don't show up to

sell something. You show up to provide value, and I like to

look at it as being invited into someone's home. So if I'm

invited into your home, I'm going to come in and I'm going

to, you know, I'm going to be gracious as a guest. I'm going

to show up maybe with a gift. I'm as a podcast guest. I'm

going to show up being prepared. So it goes well beyond just that

kind of transactional mentality, and I'm coaching guests so that

when they show up, they provide value, and their mindset is of

I'm providing value. I'm not selling or pushing my product or

service.

And and I think that and by the way, when I use

the word pitch, I I because I get so many pitches every day.

I'm able to to to what's the word where you sift through

things and and find the

differentiate. Yeah,

differentiate between the good ones and not

thank you. You and so when I get a good one, and I'm going to

share something with you. Just happened the other day, because

sometimes I think, am I being snowed, or am I flattered by

this compliment, or should I just ignore it? So I got a email

the other day from a guy who right away had a in the email,

it had a screenshot of a review that he did for my podcast. So

I'm flattered, right? Because he did that, and then he went in to

talk on to talk about how he loved this episode, blah blah

blah, and so much so that he did a review for it, and then showed

me that. And he actually is a good fit for my podcast because

he's all about relationship building and introverts and

stuff like that. But I was fascinated by the the email

first of all. But that's what sometimes gets me because you

get so much junk of people who it's you know it's not real,

like it's not thought out. By that is what I mean by that, and

in this case, maybe he's done that. Maybe that's his strategy,

but it worked because I will have a conversation with him and

see if you know. Because I always do that before I actually

have them on my show. So back to my notes, but I just thought,

you know, am I am I easily fooled?

I don't think so. I think that in this day of AI,

people can go in and they can craft something so compelling

that feels so personalized to you. Right? You you you will

sometimes see that someone is so polished and perfect via email,

and then you meet them on the pre-call, and you're like,

things don't line up, and I think a lot of times that's

where things go a little bit awry, right? I think when

someone shows up on a podcast, they show you as the host, they

show the audience who they really are, what they believe

in. So that's why it's such a great opportunity to really

highlight who you are, what you believe in and what you bring to

the table. I often tell my clients, you know, in the

beginning of a podcast, a host will sometimes say, you know,

tell us about yourself. How did you get to where you are today?

And I can't tell you how many podcasts I've listened to where

people recite their resume. I did this in middle school. I

went here, and you're like, geez, I don't need to know

everything they've ever done in their lives. Yeah. And so what

happens is, is that feels like it's very much about the guest.

Whereas when I'm coaching my clients, I'm like, we don't do

that. You show up where you bring a problem that that

audience feels a pain point. You share how you solve that

problem, and so then the the audience is like, this person is

providing me value. I want to continue listening. They're not

going to turn you off. They're going to turn you up because

they want to learn more.

Yeah, I had that as one of my questions. It's

perfect that you answered that. And where the guest can dread

that question, but they also-I mean, I don't usually ask it. I

really don't. I try to weave it into the conversation, give me a

little background here and there, and so on as we go. But

but I wondered, you know, how you do coach you? Because I

actually I had a friend who said I got on this girl's podcast.

You should listen to it. And when I went to it, the first

like 510 five to seven minutes was her telling her background,

and it's like too much, you know. I didn't want to tell her

that, so yeah, you've got to keep it quick because it's it's

not really about. It's kind of like when I do LinkedIn profile

optimization with my clients. The about section is one of the

most important pieces, but it's not really about you. It's about

who you help and how you serve them. And really, that's what we

want to know on the podcast. We don't really care about your job

from the day one, you know. But but it's interesting how people

think that there's a mic in front of them, so they'll just

go, and they don't know when to stop. So,

oh yeah, I mean, we one of the things that we do

is for the first couple of interviews for a new client,

we'll put together an interview analysis. Right, once they have

been a guest on the podcast, we'll let them know. You know,

how much how much of the share of speaking did you have? Is it

we want it to be close to 5050? So it's it's very much a

conversation. It's not them sort of reciting all the things that

they've done and and making it about them. It's it's a casual

conversation. And I often say this: the best podcasts I listen

to are the ones where it almost feels like you're sitting next

to two people in a coffee shop having a conversation, and

you're able to learn something from that. And so, to me, that's

really where the sweet spot is-is that you're able to just

have a casual conversation.

So, I'm kind of part of me is thinking as we're

talking. Oh, is is Kristen like evaluating this conversation

we're having, or did she know that it would be what what she

could, you know, because you you reached out to me. Although I

loved what I've seen of you and your personality, and then we

had a nice conversation, and I knew that it wouldn't be it

would be easy to have this conversation with you, but you

must have thought that too, or you might not have pursued it,

right?

Yeah, absolutely. You know, I always I like to

listen to a podcast. I like to understand, you know, what is

your personality. I I often tell my clients in in the very

beginning of their campaigns, you know, I'm not just putting

them on a podcast to have a good conversation. I want it to be a

connection that can continue well well beyond the recording,

and so when I'm doing that, I'm looking at you know is the host

personality one that's going to jive with you know my client. So

you know on so many different levels, I think you know I

listened to the podcast episode and I was like I love Janice's

you know personality. I. Love the questions questions that she

asks. Are my values aligned with yours? I believe that, and one

of our core values at Interview Valet is that relationships are

the ultimate currency. So for me, it's like it was a very

natural fit for the conversation. Where, as I showed

up today, I'm not nervous. I I'm looking at it like I'm showing

up to have a conversation with a friend, and we're just catching

up and and having a conversation.

That's that's perfect because that's exactly

the way I want my guests to feel comfortable, right? So yeah,

just like we're would be so fun if if I was able to do it like

you know Katie Couric or or what's her name on what's her

name? Alex Cooper. Where they can sit in a big chairs opposite

each other and have the mics and be there in the same room. I

love that, but it

just

isn't isn't the way. But you talk about borrowed

trust, and we may have covered some of this. But when a guest

steps into someone else's podcast, what do you mean by

that? What do you tell them about that? Is that you setting

the scene for them?

Yeah, yeah. I think you know, like we talked a

little bit about how you don't show up and recite your resume.

We we believe that you don't have to do that, right? Because

the host has vetted you. The host understands and said, you

know what? I like what you have to say. You bring value to my

audience. I'm going to have you on. So that's really where the

borrowed trust comes in, because you automatically have that

trust from the audience, and it's your responsibility to

nurture that and to be the guest that shows up and provides that

value. So the the idea of borrowed trust is really, you

know, you don't have to talk about all the things that you've

done. You don't have to establish that baseline of why

people should listen to you. You already have it because the host

has a dedicated audience, and you've been pre vetted to show

up. So having that mindset of like, I don't have to prove

myself or my background or anything like that, that can be

really helpful.

Do you do you coach your clients to do their

homework on the host?

Yes, and I also put together something that I

call a podcast prep document. So in that document, it's going to

give a background on the host, a background on the audience. This

is their particular target audience. Here are some

insights. Here are some suggestions around, you know,

maybe how to connect with that audience, how to answer that

first foundational question. So it's we have our brief sheet

that we utilize internally, but I have taken it a step further

to give them even more background because you know we

want we want someone to show up and fully understand the

audience that they're talking to, so that they're able to

really connect in a way that's meaningful to them, and they're

able to provide as much.

Sorry,

it's okay. It

happens. I forgot.

Nope, I was doing the same thing as I was getting

on. So

it's all right. It's all good. I don't mind

those things happening. I've had one time many, several years

ago, when I'm talking on my podcast, and my little

granddaughter walked into the office room, and she's she was

maybe three or yeah three or four, and I just I loved it so

much. It was so cute.

Yep. Well, it's it's and it's authentic, right?

It's an authentic thing. Like we have. Everybody knows we have

people around us, and it makes you a real person. It lets

people know that it's not AI and it's not exactly mistake. It's

it's real. Yeah,

exactly. Okay, you said that the best outcomes

from podcast guesting often happen after the interview is

over. What does that follow through look like?

Yeah. So when you show up as a guest, and I will

see people show up as a guest, and then they, you know, stop

hitting record and they go off. They wait for the podcast to go

live, and they're like, "Okay, where's every where's everyone?

And I believe that that's where it just starts, right? You have

so much content and visibility that you can take from that one

podcast, and you can you can nurture that relationship,

right? I you know I we take at Interview Valley we take the

short clips and we post them on our social media channels so

that we can further that relationship. I will sometimes

take a screenshot and I will like during a recording I will

obviously ask the host, hey, is it okay if I take a screenshot,

and I'll share it on my LinkedIn and say, hey, I had an amazing

conversation with Janice today. We recorded a great podcast and

we discussed this, this, and this. I can't wait to share it

with you. So that just shows that I'm excited about the

podcast and I want to have a reciprocal relationship, right?

I don't want it to be where I show up and I'm transactional. I

want to continue our conversation. If I have people

that I'm like, you know what, they could they would be perfect

for Janice's, you know, to be a client of Janice's. Or we were

talking before, and I said, hey, I have this host, which I will

introduce you to after this, where you know we can. Those

introductions with people that can ultimately change someone's

life, and so that's what I think it's really about. It's not just

it's not the recording itself. It's so many other things that I

don't believe that people take you know take into

consideration. It's not just showing up and sounding great.

It's all the things that you do after. Are you nurturing that

relationship? I got kudos to Janice because I got an amazing

card from her after our initial call. You know, it's the little

things that people don't have stopped doing, right? It's the

handwritten notes. It's the you know connecting on LinkedIn and

liking their posts and engaging with them. It's just having that

mindset of I'm building a relationship, and I'm not just

being transactional.

Okay, so thank you for mentioning the card

because I was actually going to ask you a question, not about me

sending a card, but about like I have my own you know way of

thanking people for being great guests, and and part of that is

to send them a thank you card for being on my podcast, but it

reminded me, and I don't know. Tell me if I'm wrong, but it

reminded me of this story that that happened to me when I last

bought a new car, and I was pretty excited about my car. And

I got in the driver's seat and I had the sales guy take a picture

of me in the new car, and I put that picture on a card, and I

sent it to him and said, "Thanks for you know looking after me so

well. But I'm the one that bought the car. I was the

customer. He should have sent me a card. And I kind of sometimes

think guests come on my show and they disappear. And even when I

send all the assets when the the episode goes live, I hear

nothing. That just gets right to my heart. I take it personally.

Probably shouldn't, but I I find that rude. And I tell me your

thoughts on that.

Yeah, I I have this conversation with clients

often. I will tell you, I I had a client, and I he was an

executive coach, and I you know there are a lot of coaches out

there, and one of the things that he did as a guest is at the

end of every interview, based upon the conversation, he would

send the host a book like focused on leadership that was

customized to them with a handwritten note. I had another

client. He is in the gold and silver industry, and so he would

send a little gold coin with a handwritten note. So, I really

believe that you know, as we're sort of in this age of AI,

right? Everyone can put together a pitch, and everyone can say,

"This is who I am. I truly believe that as time goes on,

the relationships and the connections that we build are

going to be what differentiates, you know, one guest from another

guest. Because I would assume that you, as a host, know other

hosts, right? And so, if if I'm coming on your podcast and I am

like a stellar guest and I'm doing all the right things, and

I'm building that relationship with you. At a certain point,

you're going to go. You know what? One of your friends is

going to come to you that's a podcast host and say, "Hey, I'm

really looking for guests. And you're going to say, "You know

what? I know Kristen. Let me introduce you. Or I know

Interview Valet. They have you know a whole a whole bunch of of

clients. Let me introduce you. And so that continues to open

doors, so I truly believe that people need to show up with that

mindset of how do I serve and how do I connect.

Beautiful. I think that just happened to me

actually the other day. Somebody reached out and I sent them four

people that I thought were a great fit for them from my that

had been on my podcast, and I've sent out the the virtual

introductions, and so far three out of four of them have

responded to me and said thanks for the introduction. You know,

I'm going to be talking to this person, you know, next week, and

I love that. I love being able to make those connections. The

other thing, I don't know how many people do this, but I have

made a point of building relationship with. I think it's

maybe three. I can count three companies like yours that send

me people, introduce me to people to be on my podcast, and

the more I feel I get to know you guys, the easier it is to

send me the right people, right? And go ahead. I don't know how

many people do that, but

yeah, I was gonna say 100% I think when you have

that relationship, people want to do more for you, right? So if

you have a need and you're like, "Hey, I'm looking for guests.

This is what I'm looking for, and we have that established

relationship. People are going to go above and beyond just

naturally and organically because they want to help you.

Right? You're not you're not just someone emailing them.

You're a friend. You're a you know colleague, and so I think

that as we continue to build upon those relationships, it

makes it easier because we learn. Who you are and what

you're looking for, and so it's no longer about here are some

generic potential guests. It's I know exactly who you are, what

your personality is, and what you're looking for, so I can

make sure that I'm sending you the right people.

So I don't know if you if you can think of this

off the top of your head, but is there a moment where you saw a

guest completely transform the way they approached an interview

and what shifted for them?

Yeah, I think I think a lot of times people look

at podcast guesting as an opportunity to show up and sell

something. Yeah, and so I can think of you know I had a

previous client and they came to me and they were like, "I want

to know the topic. I want the questions. And the first couple

of interviews, they showed up, and it felt very scripted. I

would listen, and I would sort of cringe a little bit because

I'm like, "Ooh, you know, like you're not really connecting.

And so once I was able to listen and sort of better understand

what their style was, I was able to coach them in, you know, this

is how you connect. This is this is the audience. This, and so

you can see just like a shift, and it wasn't like a bold, like

quick shift, but it helped them shift their mindset from I'm

showing up to sell something to I'm showing up to provide value.

And once they were able to do that, it was like something just

clicked, and it went from being nervous and like needing what I

call the training wheels of like the topics and the questions to

them going. You know what? I got this. I'm gonna go have a

conversation because I feel confident in who I am. So

there's also this. You know, I remember when Tom asked me to be

a guest on behalf of Interview Ballet. Literally on the call,

my first question was, "Who wants to listen to me? And I

think we've all maybe had that like imposter syndrome, or like

you know, am I being confident enough? And and it's like you

you show up and you do it, and then it becomes almost that

second nature to you because you see the value that you're

bringing.

So, just for the audience, Tom is Tom Schwab, who

is the owner of Interview Valet, and who is your boss, right? So,

I think that was completely flattering that he would ask you

to be on your his podcast, and and secondly, I'm guessing that

maybe he was nurturing you in your role and building you up. I

don't know when. Yeah.

So he he actually his mini book that he's

published is it's called From Soloist to Choir, and the idea

is that you know when you have one person guesting on behalf of

a company, you are you are the soloist, and so it was me and I

think three or four others within the company that he said,

you know, I can do this all day long, but you each have your own

expertise and your own value that you bring, and so rather

than it being a soloist, he said, you know, I have all these

people, and so we're we're the choir, if you will,

but I think you've also done some solo

episodes, haven't you? Now,

yeah. Well, no, I haven't personally, but we have

an internal podcast, so I've I did that first, and then you

know I'm I'm out talking to other hosts outside of our

internal podcast.

So just to clarify, with your role, you're

not someone who's sending out the the invitations to people

because that's like Diana, who I've worked with before, and

other people who I can't remember off the top of my head.

But is Diana still there? Yeah. Okay. So like she'll send me an

intro, and if I say, and it might be a new client to

interview valet, I'm guessing, and then so they work with you

or someone in your position after they get the gig or before

they get. I don't know, but that's not you're not doing the

the out the outreach.

No, I'm I'm doing the the client facing. So you

know, I'm the one that's coaching the clients. I'm going

through and saying if a show is a good fit or a bad fit based

upon you know what we had discussed through their

onboarding. So yeah, but

wait, wait, wait, wait. If you're going through

what is a good fit and a bad fit, but they've already is that

before someone like Diana sends out the okay yes okay yes.

So we have internally what I would call

like a triple layer approach to pull back the curtain a little

bit. So I have a prospecting team that sends me the prospect.

I know my client because I've built the relationship with

them. I say yes or no. If I say yes, it's a good fit. Then it

goes to the podcast relationship manager that screens it, and

then it goes to a host like you. So by the time it gets to you as

a host,

you know you

should feel confident that we have, you

know, gone through several people to ensure that the fit is

there. We're not just, you know, putting together an AI pitch and

sending it to you and saying, "Well, let's hope for the best.

Yeah, you know, we have a, you know, a procedure that by the

time it gets to the host, it is. So, are

you are you doing business development? And then,

are you finding, or do they come to you?

They, I, Tom is our. Yeah, he's the guy. Yes. So

they go through Tom, and then once they are ready to be

onboarded, that's when they would get to me or one of my

teammates. Yeah. And we really try to find people, match people

up, right? It's it's matchmaking for us. Yeah, we want to make

sure that the personalities align and different things like

that. We know, you know, if there are certain things like I

have a client, I tend to I have three kids, I tend to be on and

offline quite a bit during the day. So if there's a client that

you know prefers to communicate in the evenings or you know,

maybe in spare moments on the weekends, I am I am the better

fit for them because I want to communicate with them in a way

that they want to be communicated with, and so you

know we we take into account personality and communication

style and different things like that.

Okay, cool. So I don't know where this question

then fits into that triple threat thing. How should a

leader think about choosing which podcast to guest on if

they want relationships, not just reach?

Absolutely, I think that the core of that is:

Does the host and the podcast align with your brand? And as an

example, one of the questions that we ask is like, "Are you

okay with explicit podcasts? If you, and by explicit we mean

like you know nothing like raunchy or anything like that,

but maybe someone you know uses a four letter word for emphasis.

Is that something that is aligned with your brand? So I

think you start there, and then from there you go to you know is

the target audience aligned, and that's really you know the what

I would consider the baseline. And then beyond that, it's like,

is it a well-produced podcast? Would you be happy to share your

podcast episode with you know someone important to you? Is

this something that you would be proud of? So you know I will

often tell clients you know as they're coming in through

through onboarding you know once you start to guest on podcast

people will reach out to you and some of those are legitimate and

some of those are I'm starting a podcast and I know that you like

to talk and it's out in left field and has nothing to do with

what you want to talk about they're just looking for guests

and that's probably not going to be aligned with your brand, and

it's not going to look good for the brand. So it's really

critical that when you're agreeing to be a guest, that it

is a good representation of who you are and what your company

stands for.

Yeah, I think it works both ways, right? And

that's why I do prefer to have an intro call with somebody

before I say yes, usually I've made up my mind, you know,

pretty quickly. But I just want to hear some some things from

from the person and get a sense. I like to make that connection

before we go live.

Absolutely, and you know, I've had clients in

the past say, "I don't want to do any pre-calls, and I will

tell you, those clients are not the ones that I feel like have

the success. They'll be like, I'm too busy, and that to me is

a red flag because I look at a pre-call as like studying for a

test. Right, you want to connect on a deeper level and have

something to talk about rather than just hopping on and diving

right into the conversation. Had we not had the pre-call, I

probably wouldn't be as relaxed and as comfortable in the

conversation as I am right now, because I would be sort of

feeling you out, getting to know you, whereas I feel like we're

old friends. Yeah, no,

I like that, and and that's important to me. I've

been on a few podcasts as a guest, and I love guesting on

podcasts too. But where they've sent me a form and ask me all

these questions, so I'm doing the work for them by, and then

they just reiterate these questions to me. I'm like,

really, you know, and we've not had any kind of you know pre

call, and I feel that that just doesn't feel right. Now I I have

had a guy. Sorry, I you were going to say something. Go

ahead.

Oh, I was just going to say that in those

cases, like the forms, um, it's also very interesting, right? So

if you fill out the form and then you don't meet with the

host to record for a month later, a lot of times you don't

remember what you put in that form.

Exactly. I

made this mistake myself. There was one podcast,

and it said, "You know, give me three questions. Yeah, and I

just gave three questions, thinking, "Okay, well, these

will be like in their back pocket if the conversation, you

know, goes quiet. Well, the entire interview was around

those three questions, and I remember thinking, "I really

wish I had those three questions. What I started doing

is, any time that there's a form or there's something that I

supply to the host on behalf of the client, I put it in their

dashboard, so they always have the opportunity to go back and

and and reference that. So they again show up, you know, ready

to go and understanding. Hey, this is what the conversation is

going to be about. I

think that's so cheeky for the host to say,

"Give me three questions. You know that you do that work.

Yeah,

I'll come the best and do the best job I can.

I'll even do it blind. I mean, I did a podcast guesting

yesterday, and I had two guys. I didn't expect it was going to be

two guys that were running the podcast, and they we didn't have

a preamble. But he'd been on my podcast. One of them had been on

my podcast already, and so I felt comfortable with him. So

we're just having a conversation, and there were

three of us. And they said we have a rule about interrupting.

You can interrupt, you know, if something comes to mind, and it

was fun, and it was great. But that doesn't happen all the

time, and it's like when people aren't. I believe. I mean, I I

watched a podcast not long ago that somebody I knew was

guesting on, or they were going to be on my podcast, and the

person running the podcast was so uncomfortable, you could just

feel it because they're not they're they're doing a podcast

they think they should perhaps, and they've got these questions

and they're very rigid with it. It was painful, you know. Yeah,

I will tell you. I did a podcast and I I love the

podcast, so I'm not knocking this podcast or the host, but I

got all the questions beforehand, and there were like

25 questions. It was earlier on in my guesting, my guesting

career, if you will, and so it helped me feel comfortable in

the moment. That's it worked for me, but I can remember being

about 15 minutes into the into the interview, and we're on

question seven, and so I'm thinking, like, I have a, I

have, you know, I have something after the call. Got to pick

up my kids, yeah, yeah.

And I'm like, we're never getting through all

of these questions, yeah. And so then in my mind, I'm like trying

to stay three steps ahead because that's just my

personality. And so instead of me being like more relaxed and

you know, in the conversation, I'm thinking we got to get

moving. I got to make my answers shorter. I've got to do

whatever. Where you know, it it changes the dynamic a little bit

when you're when you're expecting those. And I didn't

put them together. The hosted, so you know, I I wasn't doing

the work necessarily. I think there is a time and a place for

those, like certain people need that, but I, I will stand on, I

will die on the hill of like just a casual conversation is is

far better than anything else.

Yeah, I agree. You have to have a a thread, I

think, running through it and so on to make it worthwhile, and

have some value that that person wants to share, and you want to

make sure they get it or promote their book or whatever. I mean,

I don't mind doing that. I don't, but I want something, you

know, to to feel right. That's all. Yes, and sometimes I

haven't read their book, and definitely I haven't listened to

them on five other podcasts because I don't want to be

influenced by that.

Yep, I actually love that. I um I almost feel

like you know if I if I could have the opportunity to just

introduce two people that I'm like you know what they would

have a great conversation and they don't know anything about

each other right. I I don't know if you've seen those like

stranger photo sessions where like people stand back to back

and then you know it's like a couple sort of thing, but you

know just something where you say and and I we I think we

briefly talked about this. There was um there was a host on a

podcast that I was on, and he said, "Listen, you know I we

record the podcast, but I also do these sessions where I have

two or three people, and I don't tell them anything about each

other until they show up. So they can't do you know they

can't do research. They can't show up with any preconceived

notions. They just show up and they have a conversation. And

I'm like, that's a really cool concept because I think that you

know, like he obviously has their trust that they're going

to say, "I'm going to you know have an hour or whatever on my

calendar, but it also allows people to just casually like

you. You don't get nerves about it because you're like I don't

you know I don't know if this is like someone super important

that I'm talking to or whatever, but you just show up as your

authentic self, and I think that's really where you know the

sweet spot is for people is just being who you are and being in a

room full of people that you know you can you can talk to and

and be who you are.

Yeah, I'm going to ask you a question that I ask

a lot of guests, but not all of them. Just depends on the mood

I'm in, I think. But I'm curious to ask you this question. My

favorite word, curiosity, and it's a two-part question. And

the first part is: Do you think curiosity is innate or learned?

And then the second part is: What are you most curious about

today?

Okay, so I think it's a learned skill. I don't

think that a lot of people would come and say, you know what? I

wake up every day and. I am curious, and I'm really great

with people, right? Like we all have something I believe that is

like a God-given talent of ours, and so I do think that for some

people it is it is innate, and I think for some people it's

learned. I think a majority of people it's more learned than

just sort of natural to them, and I think let me

just before you go to the second part. Then let

me ask you this: You have three children. Are they all curious?

They they are, but in different ways. So I I

will often have this conversation with my husband.

Actually, going off on a personal tangent, I believe that

you know, like I don't parent all three of my children exactly

the same, right? Each of them needs something very different.

They're very different personalities, and so I would

say that my youngest is is a lot more curious, and maybe that's

her age than you know. I have an 11 year old and a 13 year old

who think they know everything, so they're far less curious than

my five year olds. But I think you know we all we all have a

curiosity maybe at different levels.

Okay. See, I'm so curious. I had to go there.

Okay. Yeah. All right. And what are you most curious about

today?

I am most curious about, and I think the thing

that I'm I'm wanting to learn more about, I think is is I want

to learn more about AI. I think a lot of times we use AI as a

tool to you know take care of a task or you know change this

email for me. And I think I approach AI in more of a

curiosity around strategy. That's something that I really

get excited about is like strategy, and then how do I how

do I bring that strategy into my day to day life so that it can

help me, you know, be more authentic and build more with

people in terms of relationships and connection. And so I think

that's what I'm most curious about from a professional

standpoint. So it's kind of

a oxymoron, really, what you just said.

Learn more about AI so I can be more authentic, right? Because

we're we're always fighting that, and that's one thing I

wanted to share from what you just said. And secondly, we'll

have to have a conversation about AI and strategy someday

because we can learn from each other where we're both at.

Perhaps I'm happy to to do that and share what I know. And

second, and lastly, if someone is looking at guesting on a

podcast for the first time, what would be the top three things

that you would tell them?

So the the the very first thing that I would I

would tell them is get really clear on who you are, who is

your audience, and what do you what do you want the

conversation to be about? Right, we don't want this like I'm just

going on podcast to feed my ego. We want it to be about what

value do I bring? So that's number one. Number two, I think

it's really getting clear on how do you want your brand to be

represented, right? So we're not just going on any podcast that

will invite you. We want to be selective, and we also want to,

on the flip side of that, be someone that a host wants to.

Sorry,

and so is that

again because I just dropped something.

Oh, sorry. Okay, let me start over. Okay,

apologize.

Oh no, you're okay. So the second thing I

would say is to ensure that the podcast that you're going on is

going to align with your brand, right? We don't want to just go

on any old podcast. Yeah, we want it to be something that is

aligned with our brand and who we are as a person and as a

business. And then I think the third thing would be to go in

with curiosity, right? As we talked about before, I think

being curious, asking the question at the beginning, and

saying, you know, who is your audience and how can I bring

value? If you don't already know that, if you haven't done their

research. You know who is your audience? How can I bring them

the most value so that I'm coming and I'm starting out from

a mindset of you know what value can I bring versus what can I

get out of this? Because if we're out there and we're having

those conversations of how do we provide value, how do we

connect, the conversation is vastly different than how do I

sell my product or service? For

sure. Do you then encourage or ask your your

clients to do their homework and listen to a couple episodes of

that person's podcast? Because I've gotten fussier now in my

old age, and I and I do ask my guests in that pre-call, you

know, I'm going to ask you three things. One, I would love you to

listen to one or two episodes of my podcast. I'll even, if you

want, in some cases, I'll say I think you should listen to this

episode, or they'll mention somebody, and I'll say I'd love

to send you the link to this episode. You might enjoy it, you

know, something like that, and then. And I would love you to

leave a review for me as if you liked what you heard. And third,

when I send you the assets, I want you to share them. And

sometimes I don't hear anything from the people.

Yep. And I think you'll, as you sort of like

evaluate and you think about that, right? The guests that

show up and they're prepared and they they do all the things that

you're like. Hey, this is this is my minimum ask, right? The

guests that that execute those things are probably the guests

that you have much better conversations with. You build

those relationships with, and so that's why it's really like the

bare minimum you should do is exactly what you've asked,

right? Do your research. Do the promotion after after it ends.

And if you like the podcast, do a rate and review. I will tell

you, I get well. I have in the past. I had a a new client that

came in, and he said, "I don't want to be on any podcasts that

don't have 100 rate and reviews. And as we're talking about that,

I'm like, that is like a needle in a haystack. If that's like

your, if that's your like one thing that you're searching for,

I don't leave a ton of reviews myself because I, you know, it's

not like it's Amazon, right? Where when I go to Amazon, the

reviews are it, and so that's something that I need to be

better about doing is is more of the of the rate and reviews. So

you know I appreciate that conversation.

Okay, perfect. This has been delightful, as I

knew it would be. Thank you for being an amazing guest, Kristen,

and for my audience, I think that it's, I think that

Kristen's perspective is such a good reminder that visibility

without connection doesn't get us very far. Whether you're the

one guesting or the one hosting, the relationship is always the

real win. So thanks for spending the time with us, and I hope

today's conversation gave you a fresh way to think about the

conversations that you are already having. And remember to

stay connected and be remembered.

So.