378 - The Average Clinic Could 5X Their Revenue

[00:00:00] So the average clinic has the potential to generate 5X more revenue with their current space, their current hours and their current team. Without hiring any more people, without working any more hours, without getting a bigger space, the average clinic should be generating 5X more revenue if they maximized their new patient schedule, their adjusting schedule and all the different appointment types they have in their clinics.

[00:00:21] Hello and welcome to the Remarkable CEO Podcast, a show dedicated to chiropractors who want to transform their job into a business so that they can have a remarkable practice as part of a remarkable life, not instead of one. With your hosts, Dr. Pete Camiolo and Dr. Stephen Franson.

[00:00:54] What's up, Remarkables? Welcome to another episode of the Remarkable CEO Podcast, chiropractic's number one business podcast. I'm Dr. Stephen Franson. And I'm Dr. Pete Camiolo. And we have a third, we have a trifecta for everybody today. Dr. Josiah is here from Lucro, from More Lucro. Dr. Josiah, say hi, buddy. What's up, guys? How are we doing? Man, we are stoked to have this conversation today. We're talking about outcomes, right?

[00:01:22] So if we're attached to anything in the Remarkable practice, it is better outcomes. And for us, it means throughput and output, right? So when we're helping more people help more people, it shows up two ways. Greater revenue and profit. That's the business side. And then impact on humanity. Our purpose is to restore health. We can't do that if we're not increasing patient throughput. Dr. Josiah is here today to tell us about the outcomes that he's seeing in the profession.

[00:01:48] And we're actually measuring up TRP outcomes from the industry as a whole, let's call it. So we've got an incredible survey to talk about today. Just an industry report that came out for 2025. Of course, it's going to come out annually now, right? So, but we're excited about the results that we're seeing in chiropractic and very specifically and very proud of the results that we're seeing with our remarkable clients.

[00:02:11] So, Dr. Josiah, won't you tell us a little bit about the project? Why did you guys do this? Why is this important? And what does your 2025 report say to us? Absolutely. Well, thank you first and foremost for having me on this call. But yeah, the Lucro industry report is really the culmination of my vision for Lucro in the very first place, is that we have the greatest healthcare product in the world. We have people that we change their lives on a regular basis without drugs, without surgeries, and we're still trying to reach some proverbial tipping point.

[00:02:39] There's something that's missing. If we change people's lives to the degree that we say we do and that we know we do. And I just had a patient in my office that was deaf for seven years that regained his hearing in his right ear. We had another person that hadn't felt his feet in 20 years regain the feeling in his feet. Had another lady, Jane, you know, that was in a wheelchair, then went to a walker, then went to a cane, then got rid of that. She's 93 years old and she's taking ballroom dancing classes. Had another lady, Elizabeth, that could only walk seven steps before she came into us.

[00:03:06] Then she just sent us a video dancing at her daughter's wedding when she didn't think she was going to walk down the aisle, right? And so these are the changes if you're a chiropractor and you're saying, yes, I see miracles all the time. And I always joke with people that say it's like who gets called a miracle worker more often than a chiropractor? Only Jesus, you know? And so if that's really the fact and you're listening to this and you're a chiropractor, you're saying, amen, then why have we not reached that tipping point? And why have we not got to that next level? Why are we not making a bigger impact on the communities?

[00:03:33] We have amazing people. We have amazing purpose. Why do we not have more profitable businesses? And so that's really was the reason I started Lucro in the first place is to help the profession as a whole understand their numbers, make better decisions, grow and scale and have a bigger impact in their communities and fulfill the big idea. You know, that BJ Palmer started, you know, and help develop the profession.

[00:03:55] So the Lucro report is our first annual report that we came out with with the cumulative data for all of the Lucro clients saying, you know, what is the total revenue? What's everyone spending on marketing? How much everyone's spending on team? You know, how was everyone charging for adjustments for any different services? We can get a link that people can download this, you know, in the podcast description.

[00:04:16] But what I really want to focus on today, you know, is the remarkable practice and the difference we found, you know, in our clinics that are in TRP versus clinics that are not utilizing TRP. I love this. And Dr. Pete, let me just insert this before you jump in. I want to double click on something that Dr. Josiah just said to us, which is when you look at the metrics, when we get this data, the purpose of metrics is to tell us what to do.

[00:04:46] Right. So that's that's a really important thing. I think so often ego comes into play here and or people are embarrassed or afraid to look at their metrics is like we know that your business is trying to have a conversation with you. Your practice is trying to have a conversation with you. It's trying to talk to you and it's trying to tell you what it needs. You need to do more of this and less of this. Start doing this and start doing that. Making sure it's telling you where you should be investing your time, energy, focus and money.

[00:05:12] It's it's so incredible to have this kind of data coming out of it, because ultimately all of us want to make a bigger impact. All of us want to make a bigger income. And we know that you can't you can't master what you don't measure. So this is so important that we get this data because it tells us what to do. Dr. Pete, I'm excited that we've always known that we're driving better outcomes. It's nice to have somebody to come in with this size study saying, actually, yeah, you do. One hundred and thirty years it took for us to get this one hundred and thirty years.

[00:05:42] So thanks, Dr. Josiah, for finally making the invisible visible, bringing this data. And you did it very quickly. I mean, Lucro, we remember in the early when you were launching and we'd love to see or watch your growth. We've loved being a lot coming alongside of you. What struck me and this is something you and I were just we were chatting about right before we started recording was I asked Dr. Josiah, I said, tell me about like the other Lucro clients. Is this like the average chiropractor?

[00:06:06] Does Lucro, you know, generally work with more generally more successful chiropractors compared to like the industry standard? And I was blown away by what you said. So I know we're going to go through some of the metrics, but I just want to, number one, just recognize the remarkable practice doctors who are listening maybe to this podcast right now. But even if you're not and you I'm just going to I just want to celebrate you and say, hey, well done. You know, like you guys have your multipliers. It's a two to three X off of the probably the average chiropractor.

[00:06:35] And these are not the average chiropractors that work with Lucro. So and the performance has been incredible. So I just want to recognize you guys for the great work you do. I want to encourage you to keep going. I want to challenge you to keep going deeper. You have to keep learning, like Dr. Steven said, you're getting more mature. We're going to use our data. It's drama or data. You decide.

[00:06:54] Right. So and, you know, we need to we have a we have a responsibility, a physical responsibility to the shareholders in your company, including you and your and your team and then to the communities that we serve. So, no, Dr. Zaya, thank you for the work. Finally bringing this to the forefront for the profession. You do it so elegantly and so quickly. And it's just awesome. So now I look forward to digging in and double clicking on some of the things that you find is the most important data. Absolutely. Yeah. So just a real quick understanding of just kind of the framework of everything.

[00:07:23] The Lucro report, which you can download below, is everybody that had a full year with Lucro in 2025. So there's 374 clinics that are combined in that data. Since then, you know, we're about 530 clinics. And when we ran this report specifically to extrapolate the TRP clinics, there was 496 clinics. And of those 496 clinics, 112 of those clinics were clients in 20 in that time period with their remarkable practice.

[00:07:53] So that's really the baseline that you're talking about, Dr. Pete. And so what we found, you know, with the baseline, and when you extrapolate all the out, all the TRP clinics, and you look at the baseline of the Lucro clients minus TRP practices, the average revenue or the median revenue, you know, for those clinics was 608,000. Whereas the median revenue for a TRP clinic, 915,000.

[00:08:16] So about a 50% increase in top line revenue for the remarkable practice clinics compared to all other clinics inside Lucro. That's incredible.

[00:08:57] understand the importance of financial reporting, right? So leverage systems and will invest in a third party expert to give them a kind of insight. That's not your average bear, right? So we're comparing this 500 practices in this study. Let's say roughly 112 of them are TRP practices and about 400 other practices that are in the top third of the profession. And we're still seeing the TRP practices at a 50% greater top line revenue, right?

[00:09:25] So is that a fair estimate, Dr. Josiah? Absolutely. And I would say to Dr. Pete's point, you know, if I had to put a number, you know, wet finger in the air, you know, of all the clinics in the country as a whole, you know, I would say the average in the profession is probably close to that $350,000 top line revenue. So TRP practices are even closer to, you know, even closer to 3X overall revenue compared to just any general chiropractic clinic in the country.

[00:09:52] And not only that, you know, but we talk about the gold standard, you know, for a long time, we've talked about in the profession being over a million dollar practice. Well, what we found with Lucro is that 42% of TRP clinics are over a million dollar practice. So like flip a coin, if you're on TRP, you got a million dollar practice. I mean, that is amazing. I mean, compared to the baseline of a regular Lucro client, 24% of our clients overall are over a million dollar practice.

[00:10:20] So you're almost, you know, two times more likely to break a million dollar practice working with TRP. Yeah, it's cool because we do the seven figure club ceremony. I think you're aware that Dr. Josiah, we're always so proud of our doctors who reached the seven figure club. What's been cool for us, Dr. Steven, over the last few years is we have a gear, it's a gears award. And so we've had like the one gear, but now we've had two gears and three gears and four gears. You know, doctors reaching the- Six gears, 36 gears.

[00:10:48] The biggest clinic is 36 million. And to see this and to be around and be able to work together, it's just, it's beautiful. It's incredible. And it's, it speaks directly to this. I also think about one of our coaches always talked, said this quote, you know, revenue is vanity and, you know, profit is sanity and cash is king. So even, so you might say, somebody might push back, right? Dr. Josiah and say, well, okay, top line revenue. Yeah, but they're, it's heavy. It's a heavy business. Talk about the profitability.

[00:11:16] I mean, you talked about the million at 1.8 times more likely to almost two times more likely to have a seven figure practice. Profit is not being lost as a result of growth, right? These are running more successful businesses as a result. Yeah. So 50% higher top line revenue, but 2.3 times higher profitability. So, you know, not only are they have higher revenue, which is great, but the bottom metric at the end of the day, like you said, profitability is even much higher.

[00:11:45] 2.3 times higher median profitability for a TRP practice than for a baseline practice as well. Which is 230%, guys. Yeah. That's a 230% increase. So, you know, I want to make sure that people understand we're not meaning to just blow our own horn here. We're recognizing, I mean, we've got thousands of doctors listening to this podcast and you talk about loyal listeners.

[00:12:12] Our average listener listens at about 113 minutes a month, right? So they're listening to this podcast and we've been doing this for seven years. We don't gatekeep. We're telling you guys what to start doing and stop doing. We're telling you what to do. And it's so fantastic to see literally the metrics coming out that say substantiate what we're saying. These are the behaviors to actually implement, right? So no disparaging other chiropractic coaching businesses.

[00:12:40] Everyone needs a coach and we're not everyone's coach, right? So everyone needs a coach. But what I find is so many coaches will tell you how successful they are. And you know what? Frankly, I love to tell you how many millionaires we create through our coaching. You know, so it's not just like, yeah, we're millionaires. Awesome. How many millionaires do you create through your coaching, right? So it's like that's why we love our seven figure club because what we're representing is impact is making the income, right?

[00:13:09] So you can't make the income without making the impact. So if you're a seven figure practice, you're doing seven figures worth of impact, seven figures worth of value into a community. And multi-seven figure practices, they create millionaire chiropractors. So I'd rather talk about how many millionaires we're creating in chiropractic versus telling everybody how we're millionaires. Yeah. And the other piece too that I want to hit on too, you know, obviously it's great to be, you know, have the top line revenue.

[00:13:36] But the other stat, you know, two that we pulled is what percentage of clinics, you know, are not making any money for the entire year. And so outside of TRP practices, about 18% of clinics are not generating any revenue at all. And TRP, that number is only 3.5%. So, you know, not only doing better for the top line practice, but even at the very bottom, only about one fifth the loss rate of a traditional, you know, clinic.

[00:14:05] And like Dr. Pete said, this is the high end of the profession. You know, most people aren't utilizing Lucro to begin with. When you have a combined number of all Lucro clinics, including everybody that utilizes coaching, our median annual revenue for all Lucro clinics across the line is over $800,000. So we have very successful clinics in Lucro.

[00:14:24] And so, like Dr. Pete was saying, it's like really what is going on outside Lucro, outside of TRP in our profession where we have this incredible, amazing product and such a high percentage of doctors are not successful, not even not successful, but actually losing revenue overall at the end of the year. Yeah. Doc, I want to double click on that also because what I found alarming, frankly, for the profession was the trending on this one.

[00:14:48] Right. So, you know, loosely what we're looking at was looking back at 2025 numbers, the loss rate for the industry as a whole was almost 16 percent, right? Fifteen point eight percent. Right. So the TRP docs, we saw that loss rate at seven point two percent, which, you know, was what is that? Less than half of half of the loss rate. But then look how that's trending for the other practices.

[00:15:15] It trended up to almost 19 percent, whereas the TRP doctors were trending down from seven point two down to three point five. So there was a greater divergence there. Right. So seeing that the the practices in the industry as a whole were trending totally in the wrong direction, whereas the TRP practices were trending totally in the right direction. Again, that just tells me about behavior driving outcomes. Hey, Doc. Stephen Franson here. If you're like me, you know that we're in the business of saving lives.

[00:15:43] And when business is good, everybody wins. That's the good news. But here's the bad news. Most chiropractors don't own a business at all. They own a job. It's a job they love, but it's a job. And far too often, it feels like that job owns them. Is this true for you? Do you own a business or a job? Have you built and do you run your practice on brute force? Does it rely fully on your time, your effort, a pound of your flesh?

[00:16:13] Are you responsible for all growth, for all new patient generation? How about new patient conversions? Is it all up to you? How about patient care and delivery? Are you a sole practitioner, an owner operator who owns the practice, but is also the only one that is head down and bum up, taking care of all the patients? Is revenue generation or collections all up to you? Let me ask you the most telling question. Doc, what would happen if you took 90 days off? What breaks?

[00:16:44] In my experience, most on-purpose chiropractors do not lay awake at night worrying about their practice. They worry about their business. Let's slay that dragon. The Remarkable CEO program has helped hundreds of chiropractors just like you turn the job that they love into the business that they've always wanted. Are you ready to run and build your practice on leverage instead of brute force? Do you want to create the scalability and durability that will allow you to make a bigger impact and a bigger income?

[00:17:11] What would it mean to grow your practice, increase your productivity, and your profitability? Do you want to get your time freedom back? Are you ready to turn your pirate ship into a battleship? If this sounds like you, then the Remarkable CEO program is for you. Just last year, 53 of our Remarkable clients received the 7-Figure Club Award, meaning they hit the million-dollar mark for the first time or their next million-dollar level. Be it 2 million, 3 million, 10 million, up to 36 million and growing.

[00:17:41] Now, Doc, is it crazy to imagine that your practice could be next? Click the link below and learn how to apply for the next cohort of the Remarkable CEO program. We look forward to working closely with you in creating the business that supports your Remarkable life, not competes with it. I just want to speak to the trending. So we always say, you know, you hire ahead of growth, right? This is the whole thing with coaching, too. And I'm sure you've seen this, Dr. Josiah, too, with investments you've made in your business, that you make an investment.

[00:18:11] Let's say you bring on a coach or you bring on a key player, a doctor maybe, for example, and with the vision of it growing. You know, and so this is an example of doctors who choose to invest in coaching, especially coaching with TRP. You know, they're making an investment in their business that's going to pay them an ROI as a result of that. And it gets better over time. Dr. Steven, you and I always talk about this. Year one of coaching, that's good. Year two, it's really good. But wait until you get to year three and beyond. Like, coaching gets really good.

[00:18:40] It gets that much more valuable because you start to, you planted seeds, then you water them, then they grow. And there's a process of transformation. Dr. Josiah, maybe you can speak to this because you are in the world of transformation yourself. But I think that's important for the listeners to remember. Like, you might be listening to these numbers and some of you not feeling good about yourself right now. Some of you are like, you're talking to me. That's me. I'm one of those. I don't care who you are. We're all in the journey. We're here together. And Lucro is here to help you guys.

[00:19:09] If you need help with this, they're amazing. I love the work that you do, Josiah, and your team to support chiropractors, bringing them into the level of visibility, give them that confidence that they need. And that's what we exist for, too, which is why we love our partnership with Lucro. Absolutely. And that's really the synergistic effect that you're talking about is our whole goal at Lucro is to be that platform and foundation for you as TRP, as a coach, to then say, hey, this is where the bottleneck is financially.

[00:19:39] This is where the opportunity is. This is where you need to go deeper. Do you have a marketing problem? Do you have a team problem? Do you have an operations problem? Do you have a profitability problem? Do you have a top-line revenue problem? Where is your exact bottleneck? Hey, go work with Dr. P. Hey, go work with Dr. Franson. Go work with any of your fantastic coaches to go deeper into that level, implement systems, processes, and procedures to then remove that bottleneck, unlock the level of growth and profitability that is there. And so that's that synergistic effect.

[00:20:08] You know, like for myself, that's where I, you know, grew my clinic so quickly was with coaching and utilizing TRP myself. But then I was like, okay, I know, you know, all these different strategies, but how do I know when to implement them? Right. Because, you know, there might be a hundred things you should do, but it doesn't mean you should do them in order. One, two, three, five, six, seven, you know, what you need to do first, you know, but then after you implement that 30 days later, what you thought was the second thing you should do, you know, now is the 22nd thing you should do. And what you thought was the 37th most important thing, now automatically moves up to the second thing.

[00:20:37] And so things are always dynamically changing. And so try and just say, you know, go step by step by step. Like this is just some, you know, basic format. This isn't the case of being an entrepreneur and owning a business. And so being able to have dynamic feedback, you know, from your financial data, your practice data, your vital signs, and then your marketing data, those are your three sources of data and truth that are going to really make you the true CEO, you know, remarkable CEO for your company to be able to scale and grow and continually make the right decisions

[00:21:05] of where you're directing this company to focus on eliminating bottlenecks. That's exactly right. You can't fix what you can't see, right? So, you know, this is a, if you're going to try to run a remarkable business, it has to be a data-driven business. If not, you're guessing, right? So when we look at this, we're measuring outcomes. You guys are all fixated on outcomes. It's like behaviors drive outcomes. So you look at an outcome and it tells you about the behaviors, right? That's the upstream thing of the belief system. You have to understand that.

[00:21:35] So as coaches, we look at this and we say, okay, so do you know why, if you pay attention to like the special forces, why do all special forces missions happen at night, right? So if you look at, watch the American special forces, every single mission you see on television, what do they have in common? They're all at the dead of night, right? Why do they do that? It's because they have night vision and their opponent doesn't have night vision, right?

[00:22:03] So the special forces have night vision. And in that attack, they can see at night and their enemy can't see. So what this data gives us as coaches and as business owners is night vision. So many of you guys are trying to fight at night and you don't have night vision. You can't see what's going on in your practice or in your business. We love Lucro because as coaches, selfishly, this puts us in a position to do our best work.

[00:22:31] Like data like this, this type of information to a coach is like rain and sunshine to a landscaper, right? So it's like, this is what allows us to do our best work, tell our clients exactly what to do. And frankly, all of the practice owners and business owners out there, if you're operating without this type of insight and this type of data, you're operating, you're trying to fight a war with no night vision. So thank you, Dr. Josiah Lucro. You guys are fantastic. I love that analogy. I'm going to steal that. I love that.

[00:22:58] I use the financial GPS analysis, same thing, very similar. It's like, you never know what you're going to do. You might need to take a left turn. You might need to take a right turn. But if you got your GPS on, it's going to automatically reroute you. And that's what your numbers should be doing for you too. You know, they're always calculating, recalculating, redirecting course. You know, so you're always heading in the fastest, most efficient, you know, route to your success. That's exactly right. I know that this is, you know, just we're having a conversation here,

[00:23:24] but, you know, I love listening to and learning from, you know, experts. And I'm just grateful for you, Dr. Josiah. I just want to recognize you and thank you for taking the time to join us, you know, on our podcast. And you're a regular, you've been a guest more than once, but we love having you back. And just thank you for the work that you're doing. You know, I just want to ask one final question as we kind of wrap here today. It's a future-paced question.

[00:23:49] But, Doc, when you look out ahead, you know, when you look ahead, you know, the next one to three years in our profession, you know, what are you seeing, you know, being, you know, from a trending perspective? What do you, when you look at analyzing data, talking to chiros, looking at their numbers, any advice you would give, you know, a chiropractor listening today that, like, you spoke about seeing ahead. And you've always been a visionary and you are. Do you have anything you want to share just with our listeners? Just that they need to be thinking about as we head into 2027 and beyond. Just anything that's on your heart.

[00:24:19] That'd be great to hear. Yeah, no, I appreciate it. I think we've been focusing a lot on revenue. And what I would shift the gears for this final thought is on expenses. And, you know, we talk a lot about top line numbers, which are fun. But like you said, at the end of the day, you know, revenue is vanity, profit is sanity. And how can you really maximize the profitability of your business? And the drum that I've been beating for the last few years that I really feel like unlocked, you know, my own headspace for my clinic. I told you, Dr. Pete, you know, candidly just for the call that right now we're on pace to do about

[00:24:49] 900,000 this month, you know, for my one location clinic. And the really the big thing that helped me understand my mindset was really understanding capacity and percentage of schedule filled. Because whether your schedule is 100% filled, 50% filled, 20% fill, your payroll is the same, your rent's the same, your utility bill is the same. Most all of your expenses are exactly the same, whether you're maximizing your capacity at 100% or whether you're at 50%.

[00:25:13] And so understanding exactly where your bottlenecks are from where you are now to where your highest potential is, is what people always need to be working on. I think a lot of people are always looking for a new shiny object or an extra thing or something else that they can add on. But the secret to scaling is really, really simple. It's maximize your schedule first and foremost, and then you increase your schedule. So you got to maximize your capacity. And if you don't know and understand what your capacity is to begin with,

[00:25:41] well, then how can you maximize what you don't have? You're in the blind, in the dark, and you got a Navy SEAL right beside you, about to shoot you in the side of the head, and you don't even know he's there, right? And so that's the exact same thing is you've got to first understand what your capacity, what is the potential that your practice has in the first place? And I'd love to do this in-depth study with TRP because we found the profession as a whole is only maximizing currently about 20% of their capacity, of the clients that we bring on. We do a capacity calculation in our onboarding process.

[00:26:11] And right now we're at about average of about 20%. So the average clinic has the potential to generate five times more revenue with their current space, their current hours, and their current team. Without hiring any more people, without working any more hours, without getting a bigger space, the average clinic should be generating five times more revenue if they maximized their new patient schedule, their adjusting schedule, and all the different appointment types they have in their clinic. So to me, that is the unlocked potential within our profession,

[00:26:39] is maximizing the capacity that we're already paying for. That's exactly right. Maximize and optimize. So many people are looking for that next value center to add, the next revenue stream or profit center, and shiny objects. And they're just adding stuff, and they have not optimized what they're currently offering. And the punchline here is if they were to optimize, then three to five times to the bottom line.

[00:27:05] So when you look at your profitability, it's like you'll see a 300 to maybe 400, potentially 500% increase in profitability. So just awesome. Dr. Josiah, we appreciate you, man. Excited we're going to get to see you in Maryland at the TRP Immersion. I'm hoping Adam's going to be there as well. And we'll have the Lucro team there supporting our team. So thanks for all the work you do. Excited to see the upward trending and the 2027 report when it comes out. That's right. Yeah.

[00:27:34] Thank you for having me. Yeah, buddy. Please stick around for more business insights from this week's bonus interview with our remarkable success partner dedicated to helping you more successfully help more people. Enjoy. What's up, Remarkables? Welcome to another segment of our success partner conversations. I'm Dr. Stephen France, and I've got a very special guest here. One of my buddies, one of my surf buddies, Dr. Miles Boswin. What's up, Miles? Hey, buddy.

[00:28:04] Good to see you, man. Thanks for thinking of Miles. Yeah. So Miles and I have known each other for years, but we got to know each other in one of the best ways possible, which is in the ocean. We were into Mexico together. Caught some awesome waves out in Salinas. That was just amazing. Miles, it's been too long since we've been on the water together. We've been in too many seminars together. Yeah, I know. For sure. Not enough surf trips. So we need to reconcile that. All right, brother. So this is a very simple format. We got a few questions I'm going to ask you.

[00:28:34] You know the purpose of our success partner program is to help more people, right? So you guys are somebody that we would consider like an integrated partner of ours where it's actually intrinsic to our content. We're actually promoting. We want our clients to use you as part of the remarkable practice system, right? So that says something, right? So we select our partners specifically because we want to reduce friction. We want to make it easier for people to see more people, to be able to help more people.

[00:28:59] And we know that there's so much administrative headwind that just slows down teams and that slows down doctors and slows down growth and slows down impact. So let's talk specifically about three problems you guys help people solve. And then let's get right into how you help them solve it. So I'm going to slide the mic over to you. Let's talk specifically about pain, right? So what kind of pains are you guys solving? Because I know you're really helping our clients a lot. Yeah, for sure. Let me just say thanks for having me. And I also want to acknowledge that a number of your coaches have been our clients for the longest time.

[00:29:30] And so you're not lying when you say you want your doctors using this from the standpoint of not just your doctors, but even your coaches using us. So let's say it this way. What are the pain points? Listen, every doctor struggles with or has the experience of people dropping out of care prematurely. Like we've all experienced that the patient's pain goes away, you lose them. The patient's insurance runs out, you'll lose them. It's time to pay again, you'll lose them. Like there's all these, you know this, friends. And Steven, you know, like there's these places that it's common to lose people.

[00:30:00] And quite frankly, doctors are losing money, right? Their taste visit average is lower. Their PVA is lower. Their overall collections are lower simply because they're just losing people. We're all in this business to take care of people, save lives. And to save lives mean people have to follow through. People have to stay under care. And I often ask this from stage is that, hey, if there was one thing you could learn that was important beyond how good of a doctor you are to get better clinical outcomes, what do you think is the most important thing you can learn?

[00:30:28] And at the end of the day, it's having patients listen to you and follow through. Because at the end of the day, we get a lightning bolt flying out of our fingertips. And if people aren't listening and following through, it doesn't matter. It doesn't matter how good of a technician you are or clinician you are. So the problem, the pain points we solve is we have figured out how to stop people from dropping out. I mean, we figured it out. We've now repeatedly done this in my own personal practice. My PVA was well over 300 visits applying these things, extremely high PVA.

[00:30:55] And we now see doctors who apply the things we teach and the problems we solve or the tools we provide, which I'll share, having their PVA skyrocket. That's at the end of the day. And this is why you guys resonate. That's why we resonate together. Because we're all about converting, retaining, right? It's all about automations and using tools to systematize what we do in practice so that we're ultimately delivering on the promise of chiropractic. So the pain points we solve is- You're singing our song here, Miles. Yeah. I love it.

[00:31:21] So these are all listeners of the Remarkable CEO podcast. You're talking about thousands of chiropractors who self-identify as CEOs or aspire to be CEOs, right? So which means what are we looking for? We're looking for leverage, right? We're looking for systems. Everybody's here for process, procedure, systems for leverage, right? To create scalability and durability, right? So that's our love language here. So when you say we're going to systematize everything, we want to be able to automate everything, there is a process, right? There's a four-step process that we teach on this podcast, which is operationalize,

[00:31:52] optimize, then automate, right? So what we're talking about here, gang, listen, CEOs, this is an automation element, right? So this is the automation. Operationalize, get the system in place. Professionalize, make sure you have the right person running it, right? Optimize it, which means have your data so that you're data-driven and making good decisions and then automate it, right? So bring in a system that can automate it. So I'm excited to hear more about it. I know because so many of my clients use it. You know, so there's three very specific solutions that you guys bring.

[00:32:21] Let's just take it from the top. Let's take it from the top. So the core platform we provide is ultimately, we help solve one of the biggest challenges doctors have, and that is building their care plans in a compliant way. The thing we often see is doctors, when it comes to their finances, they don't realize they are doing things wrong. And that's not to scare people, but the reality is, is that when we look at the number one reason doctors get in trouble or the number two reasons doctors get in trouble, when I say in trouble, state board complaints, malpractice claims, it's issues over money.

[00:32:51] And I can't emphasize this enough that in some states, the number one reason is issues over sexual misconduct. In other states, the number one reason is finances or finances come in second. Meaning doctors, you've got to do this right. You can't just make it up or do what your buddy down the street does or go on Facebook and say what they do. Like you got to do this right. And that's where we excel. We are the number one platform, make sure you're doing care planning. Not that's just profitable and successful in a business perspective, but that's compliant. That's going to keep you out of trouble.

[00:33:19] So doctors will sleep better at night knowing they're doing their care plan. So the core product we offer is a tool called the care plan calculator. It calculates your care plans. It calculates everything correctly, but it formats it in a way that makes sure you're doing it compliantly, both from a language standpoint, as well as the way if you're doing any kind of discounting on your services, that's being handled correctly. So doctors sleep well at night knowing they're not going to worry about some financial thing biting them in the ass later on.

[00:33:45] Because as you know, CEOs, the bigger you get, the bigger you're our target. The bigger we get as businesses, the bigger target we have on our back. It's really important you're making sure your thing's doing right. So as a growth standpoint, this is not one you want to cut corners on. And I'll share with you one of the things we're seeing today, especially in the world of AI, is we're seeing examples of doctors going, oh, I'll just ask ChatGP to do this kind of stuff for me, or Gemini or Grok. And I will tell you that's a mistake. Much of what we're seeing is being provided, not just isn't compliant, but the big reason

[00:34:15] is AI tools are making mathematical errors. If you're not aware of this, AI is a language tool. It's not a math tool. And we've actually done experiments where we've actually asked AI to calculate things for us. And it nine times out of 10 gets the math wrong. The math is wrong. And you can do the test yourself. Ask it to do some basic arithmetic, and you'll see it comes off oftentimes with wrong answers. That being said, it's a risk to losing money. So that being said, we are a solution. Can I drill down on that a little bit?

[00:34:44] Because I want to create a little clarity around this. Because in the remarkable practice, as you know, we try to create clarity around the distinction between a care plan and a financial plan, right? You give people a care plan, which is the clinical recommendations for care. Okay. This is what you need to do to get the results that you're looking for, right? And then the financial plan is the economic agreement, right? That's the financial agreement they put in place.

[00:35:09] So this product is the care plan calculator, which I believe my understanding of it is that it's a financial tool. It gives, yeah. You're taking the care plan and applying it to, you're taking the rates of the clinical services, and you're calculating the financial plan from that, right? I think we're just using different language. We've always referred to it as a treatment plan as the clinical part, and the care plan was the financial part. But I can understand where the confusion could come from.

[00:35:34] So the financial part, care planning is like, from my perspective, the way we use the term care plan is the financial, and then we refer to the treatment plan. Same idea. We have the treatment part and the financial part. That's exactly right. And you know this, you'll ask a hundred chiropractors how they terminology, what terminology they use, and you'll get a hundred different answers. Exactly. And I want to make sure that we don't confuse this audience who does hear that. So I want to make sure everybody hears that. Thank you for clarifying that. It is the financial plan that we're talking about doing the calculations for that. Absolutely. I didn't mean to interrupt you. Keep going, Miles.

[00:36:03] So the next thing is, so we solve the pain point of making sure you're doing that stuff compliantly according to the federal government's rules, et cetera. All of that stuff is taken care of. The second thing we offer is when it comes to your financial plan or care plan in this case, and there's money involved, there's a variety of ways you can collect that money, right? You can have people pay for it one visit at a time. You can have people prepay. You can have people make a down payment. There's lots of ways you could model that. We've identified, and I'm sure you're aware of this, the best way of doing this is that

[00:36:30] people on some form of monthly payment is the absolute gold standard. And even more than gold, platinum is to have them make a down payment followed by smaller monthly payments. That model is absolutely killer to do. That means you've got to process those payments. So we are a payment processor too. So you could use our system to run those payments, those recurring payments. And I know chiropractors have lots of alternatives, and there's other companies that offer those kinds of services in this world today.

[00:36:56] We've been doing it for the longest in chiropractic, and we have a team of people who know how to handle this in a chiropractic office. If you are interested in migrating to us from another platform, we do make it really easy where we automatically can import your auto debits into our system for you. So a migration from another platform to us becomes very simple to do. We do this probably every week where we have people leaving another competitor who's doing payment processing, and they come over and we're able to actually migrate their data very quickly. So you said something there that I don't want to miss because you blew right through it, but it was gold.

[00:37:26] So as we talk about financial plans, there's lots of 50 ways to skin this cat, right? You can do pay as you go. You can do pay if you want. You can do prepay, right? You can do monthly even payments, right? And the most popular and our favorite to promote is I think the same one you guys love, which is the down payment plus payments, right? So how many thousands of case studies do we have here for you to give an opinion here, Miles?

[00:37:53] I can say this is by far the most successful experience when we see growth of a practice that the doctors who are routinely offering an initial care plan or treatment plan and offering the financial option of having a down payment with monthly payments, we routinely see, as long as there's a monthly payment involved, those patients transitioning onto lifetime maintenance and wellness care. Which I'm sure you're aware, that's where the massive growth of a business is that you're only seeing so many new patients every month and every year.

[00:38:21] And if we look at our data and our case studies, we could see the revenue from new patients pretty much the same year to year. But where the massive growth of the company comes from is they're piling more and more people into their wellness and maintenance programs on these monthly payments. And that's where this growth goes in a 10x their practice over the course of a decade. That's from these monthly payments. And we do case study after case study in that scenario. Yeah, so we're big advocates of the monthly recurring revenue model, the membership model, subscription model, get everybody over there as quickly as possible.

[00:38:51] This audience understands and they hear us say that having somebody on recurring revenue, it's going to increase their spend two to 300%. But more important, their lifetime value, their LTV because of retention and stick rates goes to 800% increase. That is an unthinkable number, right? So when you see that LTV go up by an 8x, it's just unbelievable. So getting them onto a recurring model is absolutely paramount. When you do the down payment plus payment, there's another benefit that people don't think about, which is your cash conversion cycle.

[00:39:20] So if people understand your CAC or your cost required customer, if you get that down payment plus payments, it does several things, right? So most people do have that emergency fund that they'll tap into was unexpected expense. And so they'll pay the down payment there. But then chiropractic care, if it's, you know, we're principled chiropractors here. Yeah. Chiropractic is a lifestyle success strategy for healthy human beings, right? So we want to see people getting regular chiropractic care, which means we want it to be in their regular family budget, right? So now they're in a monthly budget.

[00:39:49] So you do the down payment plus payments. The down payment comes out of that emergency credit card that they use if they blow the radiator or the water heater at the house goes or some unexpected expense. And then they shift over to, I can put that lower monthly payment into my family's budget and it makes it much more palatable, right? So absolutely. And that first down payment is how you claw back your cost to acquire a customer. So your cash conversion cycle can go to instead of 30 days, 60 days, 90 days.

[00:40:17] In other words, getting the money back that it costs you to acquire a customer, you can get that back on day two, right? Absolutely. I love this system. I think it's fantastic and nobody does it better than cash practice. So if people want to learn more, Miles, what's the best way to, how do they, I'm going to put it in the show notes guys, but I just want to make sure you guys reach right out. The best thing to do is simply go to cashpractice.com, go to our website. You'll see a button, a book, a book, a call. The best thing to do is actually just have a quick 10 minute conversation with one of our team members.

[00:40:46] That way they could just see if it's the right fit for you before we go into demos and before you make any big commitments or like just to have a quick conversation with our team. They're skilled at asking the right questions and seeing whether we're right fit. If you're coming from TRP, I'm guaranteeing you, we're likely a right fit for you. We're in sync with what we do. And simply there, there's no obligation, but they'll schedule a time for them to do a demo, demonstrate our software, answer your questions. If doctors simply go look at our reviews, go to our Google reviews, go to our trust index reviews, maybe we'll give you a link for that for you to be able to see our reviews.

[00:41:16] You'll see we have hundreds of reviews, all five star, everybody raving about what we do because it kicks ass. I can't help but say, I mean, we've been doing this for a long time. We kick ass at what we do. We're run by, you know, founded by a chiropractor who has an engineering background and not just the chiropractor who went to school to become a chiropractor. So ran a successful business. And we have a whole team of people who are very familiar with what you're doing in your practice. We don't offshore our people to do support. We're not using AI agents to support you. We're using real life humans who know what's going on in your practice to be able to serve you and help you and help you grow the practice.

[00:41:45] So it's a great product. So many of our TRP docs use it and love it. Right. So you've had hundreds of TRP docs over the years. So they love this service. And as coaches, we love them using it. I'll tell you that right now. So self-serving. I like my clients to use it. Right. Because I know that they're doing it right. And they're not distracted by doing something wrong or getting the big distraction of getting busted for doing something wrong. Right. So you're a remarkable CEO. You lead a remarkable team. Holly's extraordinary. And I know that you've always traditionally had such a great team.

[00:42:14] I appreciate that about you, man. Thanks so much for all you do to help our chiropractors help more people, brother. Absolutely, Stephen. Thank you so much for having me. And we're looking to be a further service to the TRP team. Cash practice. Dr. Bob Watson. Love you, brother. You too, buddy. See you, bye. Thanks for listening to this episode of the Remarkable CEO Podcast. Remember, what the world needs now is chiropractic. And what chiropractic needs now is more successful chiropractors.

[00:42:44] If you like this podcast, please subscribe, share with a friend, and leave us a review. And if you'd like to connect with us personally, direct message us on Facebook, LinkedIn, or Instagram. Now go and be remarkable.