Positive Psychology and the Art of Flourishing with Brenda Jasmin l S1E064

Are you someone on a spiritual journey, seeking to deepen your connection with your higher self? If you're eager to release fear, overcome self limiting beliefs and find relief from emotional stress and anxiety. Then there is a call for love. And I'm your host, Linda Orsini, guiding you on your journey to awaken your inner healer by getting unstuck from old patterns through mindset, movement and meditation. Let's begin.

Welcome Friends, Welcome to a call for love. I am so excited to share with you my guest today. I was on her podcast and I just loved our conversation. We have become friends. I'm going to just say that because we are very aligned and I know you're going to love her. And her message. Her name is Brenda Jasmin. And she is a resilience trainer, certified life coach, creator of the happiness habits Academy and host of she flourishes podcast. She also lives in the same city as me. And it is such a blessing because I know that I have somebody that I can turn to now. And she has a wealth of information. Brenda delivers workshops on positive psychology, the science of well being to corporate and public audiences. She's very well versed. She has a popular series of positive psychology workshops called positivity talks. Oh, I love that Brenda. And Brenda is passionate about helping people experience greater wellbeing and less stress using research based tools from the field of positive psychology. She has a wonderful family and she is not just a coach. But she is passionate about giving talks. And she loves walking and hiking and watching sunrise and downhill. skiing's sounds like Brenda, you are very well versed and I am so happy to introduce you to a call for love community.

Bank. Thank you so much, Linda, what a pleasure it is to be invited to come on your show. Thank you so much for having me. Yeah, it's really exciting. I, I always say the one thing that I love about podcasting is the amazing people I meet and I get to share with the listeners. So really thank you for for coming on, I really feel that you have a lot of knowledge in the positive psychology. So maybe to begin, you could talk about your history in that realm and how you bring that into your podcast, she flourishes. Okay, yes, well, positive psychology is one of my favorite things to talk about. And I got into it. So it's, it's, I actually did my university degree, I have a BA in psychology. And so I'm going to date myself. But back in the day, when I did my degree in psychology, psychology was actually really just a field that was based on what's wrong with people. So instead, they weren't studying like, what can make you happy or what can bring you fulfillment, it was really about all the things that can go wrong with us. And, you know, maybe how to fix it, but they didn't have answers for a lot of that.

But it was really about all the things that you know, and and serious things like all the mental health issues people can have, but also things like how does the brain work, social psychology, child development, all of that. And so I always say, like, I was studying psychology, but on my, in my dorm room next to my bed, I would have a stack of books that were those selfhelp sort of pop psych books. And so I would have like, you know, it was really Tony Robbins and I would read Dale Carnegie books and later on, you know, Stephen Covey and and all of these, you know, Wayne Dyer, I would be reading these different self help books, and thinking, you know, this is the type of psychology that I really love that I want to be studying. I want to be helping people be the best they can be like, how do you set goals? How do you have fulfillment in your life in your career? And so I got my degree in like 1993 Back when positive psychology wasn't a thing, and then fast forward to 1999 2000 Dots when the head of the Positive Psychology Association said, Wait a second. Psychology, it's kind of been a half baked cake. We've been looking at what's wrong with people, but we haven't been looking at what's right with people. And we haven't been looking at how do you know we can get someone from maybe being depressed to feeling neutral? But how do we move them north of neutral? How do we make people actually happy and flourishing? And so in 1999 2000, positive psychology became a field and they started doing a lot of studies. And I went and got my certification as a positive psychology practitioner. So I did a certificate and applied positive psychology. And so my dream of all those what was it all those books, when I was in university when I really wanted to be studying, finally, you know, things caught up in the field, and they actually started studying. So what I loved about it is all the stuff I was reading in those self help books now, we have some science backed evidence. Science backed some research around and so some of the things that people were saying were good, actually, they the research didn't, it didn't work, right. So now what I love is we can take a lot of the things from from self help, but apply science to them. So I know that's a long, I am really passionate about it. And that is the story, though, of how I got involved in positive psychology.

Yeah, it's just reminds me of the health fields, you know, are we are we treating the sick? are we promoting healthy?

Yes, exactly like that? Yes. They actually showed us in our training for positive psychology that that health continuum, the exact same thing and so true, it's the same thing in psychology as in health.

And I believe that she flourishes, listeners and a call for love listeners are already on that road already established, knowing that they are mindful of, you know, what they're thinking and how we're living. And so I feel is very aligned.

Absolutely. And part of positive psychology, one of Dr. Martin Seligman, he is the considered sort of like he was the head of the Psychology Association when he said we need to embrace positive psychology and study it as well. And he talks about five different pathways to flourishing. But there is a sixth now that people are adding on which is health and vitality.

Oh, well, this is a great concept because health and vitality that's what we all want, but what are the other five?

So and it's known as the the model is called perma. perma v. And so the P stands for positive emotion. So perma is like an acronym. So the P stands for positive emotion. The E stands for engagement. And that's kind of like where we get into that flow state where we're using our strengths in our in our life. The R stands for relationships. And so that's a pathway to flourishing. And actually research is showing now that that's one of the number one pathways to flourishing is our relationships and, and the emotion of love. And you know, call for love podcasts, all the things you do. The emotion of love is is so important. And relationships is one of the ways to experience that. The M and perma V stands for meaning and purpose. So that's being connected, like having a life with meaning. And also feeling connected to something greater than yourself, whether it's a cause or spirituality, whatever that is, the A stands for achievement and accomplishment. So it's like setting how we feel greater happiness and well being when we set a goal. We go after it and we accomplish it. And then as I said, so that's the perma and then the Wii is is vitality. In Australia, there's a model it's perma with an H on the end. So there's different ways of looking at it. But the original one was just perma. Without the Wii and without the ah,

yeah, it's, it's, I love those and they're so vital, and they're so important. You know, all these and I think our relationships, especially since the pandemic, we are now more than able to see how important relationships are I went out today, and I ran into different people getting together you know, in coffee shops or walking along the street. I just feel that people are so thirsty, so eager to get back into really living in deeper relationships. Is that correct? Do you feel less?

People are hungry for it actually there. And and you're right, the pandemic showed us the other thing that showed us that relationships, how important they are. And you may have heard of it, the world's longest study on life satisfaction and happiness. For humans, it's, it's through Harvard, it's like over 75 years old years, they've been carrying on this study now, where they've looked at what, what's the greatest link for, you know, the good life, health, longevity. And the number one predictor of good health and happiness is your relationships to the point where if they take a 50 year old, and they look at their cholesterol levels, and they look at their relationships, their relationships have a greater impact on their future, health and, and longevity, longevity and life satisfaction, overall happiness than their cholesterol level. So it actually can help us live longer and live a happier life when we have those. And so it was a predictor of that was your the quality of your relationships. And I agree, I think with the pandemic, I think we are, we're hungry. I think if the funny thing has happened, though, Linda, I think, on one hand, and I even feel it myself, even though I'm an extrovert is that on one hand, it was like we missed people. But then we also kind of liked not having to go out. You know? So I think as much as we crave it, I think we're happy when we get out. I remember doing things and then we're glad like we came home, we come home, and we're like, oh, I'm really glad I did that. But I think it's we've lost some of our you know, having to get up and go somewhere. I think we've lost some of our skills, and even our motivation to do that even though but we're craving it. The other thing, I think that's happening, and and I don't think I don't know that there's any research, I think it'll be interesting. I think history is going to tell a story here. But I think with the hybrid workplace, and a lot of people working from home. I think there's a lot of isolation, there's there is they're calling about they're calling it an epidemic of loneliness. I think we're looking to our screens for that feeling of connection, but we're not getting it. So I don't know, I'm not I'm not sure if you've read anything on that research wise, but I do think we're becoming more and more isolated. And we're hive creatures, we're meant. we're social creatures, we're meant to be with other people. So I think the more we can remember that even when we don't feel like figuring out the outfit to go out, that we we really put that in our lives and try and make relationships a priority.

Well, it's so interesting, you say that because I'm an extrovert, too. I love people. I love meeting new people. Honestly, it gives me high. But I learned to say no. And I actually discovered that I needed some downtime. Now I don't know if it's because you know, I'm getting older every year. But I did discover that and it's so interesting that you say about working from home, because I have to tell you, my eldest son, who is very much out there and connecting, he loves working from home. So it's interesting why this is happening and how the effect I you know, it's like I say, the liberated woman does what she wants. And maybe if you're doing what you want, then maybe that's a good thing. But if you're forced, if you are forced to be a hybrid, or just online, when you when it didn't work for you, then that's not healthy. Yes,

I think so. And I think and remember to like, probably if they're having lots of meetings and connecting with people and talking, they might be getting that opportunity for extraversion as opposed to maybe someone who isn't in as many meetings and they're just, you know, talking to they're like, they're just on their computer all day. So I think you're right and yeah, people it's, I think, you know, going into the office, I think is a good thing probably is what we're gonna find, like as I think time will tell the story. But yeah, personality definitely plays a role in it for sure. And, and commute time, I think to like if people have a really long commute, that can be really draining, but I would like to see that people are still meeting in person. And I actually just had someone on my podcast talking about like these high, it's more of a high touch. Being in a more high touch situation like the in person you really are experiencing the relationship at a bit of a different level when you're in person than then over zoom. Yeah,

absolutely. I would like to talk a little bit more about engagement slow.

That's one of my favorite topics. and meaning and purpose, I really love talking about two. Okay, so engagement and flow. So this is the whole idea of. So with engagement, it's really about being engaged in your life being engaged in what you're doing. And so when we talk about that, from looking at flourishing, the leading expert in this area in flow is Miquel cheek sent me Hi, it's very long name, but he's, he's the researcher, and what he's done a lot of work in this area. And the idea of flow is when you're doing something and you lose track of time, like you love it so much you're so engaged in what you're doing, it's something you're passionate about, you probably feel it, you know, in the work that you do when you're, you know, whether it's podcasting or running your program, and you just feel like time is almost standing still, because you're just so in the moment. And that is a form of flow when we feel and it's a time to when you feel like you have the skills, and you're not doing something that's outside your skill set, but it's still taking skills to do it. So if you're doing something that's too hard, then you feel anxiety. Or if you're doing something that's too easy for yourself, you kind of feel apathy, or you get bored with it. But when the flow happens when your your skills, meet the what's in front of you, like the demand of the work that you're doing, and and there's just that beautiful flowstate I think of music, right? And there any and people say like you're at one with the music is a way of of saying it when you're in that moment. And I think one way, you know is to look at that, too. If you're looking at fulfillment and meaning and purpose, the link there for me is that you're able to say like, what am I passionate about? Like, what do I love to do? Like, what where do I lose track of time? I have to be careful with this one. Because, you know, some people say, Well, I lose, they lose track of time. And Martin Seligman who I mentioned, Dr. Seligman, who's who's started this whole positive psychology, he gets into a flow state when he's playing bridge. Well, that's not necessarily adding like to your life and the world. Like it's it can happen with your hobbies, too, which is good, but it can also borderline on the obsessive, so we have to, we have to be careful, but definitely looking for those things in your life. And it's not usually just one thing. For me, when I'm teaching workshops, I get into that flow state, when I'm downhill skiing, I get into that flow state. So it can really be different things in your life. Another thing that links with engagement is when you're leading with your strengths. And so what they've done is they've actually taken a big part of positive psychology as they've taken. They they did a study, well, not even a study, this was like a huge undertaking, where they looked at what are the top 24 character strengths of humans? And this is like, all over the world, regardless of religion or race, what traits do humans value? What are the character strengths, and, and this is something if your listeners want to do it, there's actually a free survey, it's called the Via character.org. If you go there, you can take the survey for free, you can measure yourself on the 24 strengths, it's just a quick survey. And it'll tell you, what, where you score on all the strengths. And it'll tell you what your top five signature strengths are. And what's really great with that is that they the research shows that and we know it ourselves, right? When you're able to demonstrate your strengths in the work you're doing in the world or in your family at home, whatever it is you're doing, we're actually happier, we have greater life satisfaction. And we're more engaged with others and with our life when we are when we're able to demonstrate our strengths. So that's something that can really lead to flow as well. Yeah, I

love that. I do feel that. I don't know I am meeting a lot of women now who are transitioning, so they were working full time, and maybe they're heading into retirement. And that engagement piece is shifting. And I feel that there can be a time that there's a feeling of loss, like like they're going from one kind of identity and purpose and passion to a new one. And the limbo time is is a little bit challenging. And actually would you like to talk to that? So if somebody knew how they were engaging and flowing and was working really well, but I mean, as your life changes, and you shift and you move forward? That's going to change too. So how do you embrace that? How do you work with that?

Yeah, that's a great, great question, Linda, because I think it's true like maybe you put a lot A lot of effort into like finding a career where you are doing all of these things, and you are in a flow state and you are able to share your strengths. And then especially with a time like retirement, it's like, Oh, my goodness, like my strengths aren't, I'm not able to use them in the same way. So what I would recommend in that case, is that you give yourself time, right? And I know you talk a lot about stillness, and just getting quiet with yourself and really thinking about what you want, like what do you really want, not what you think, you know, someone else wants you to do but what you really, really want. And take some time to do that. And think about like what would give, especially I think, with retirement, and when we get to this age, we really want more meaning and purpose. You often earlier times in our career, it can be about the prestige, or the money, the the education, the accolades, whatever that is. And yet, as we retire, that is often a time when people will take the skills that they had in their career, and they'll link it to something that gives them a sense of meaning gives them a sense of purpose. So I would say like, maybe there's something like a cause that you really love or something that one thing way to think of something causes that are important to you, as they say, think of something that breaks your heart. Like what's something that, you know, when you hear about it, that it really breaks your heart. And for some people, maybe it's animals are. For others, it's maybe you know, children who are abused, or you know, whatever that is, but and maybe then you can say, maybe I can take some of those strengths from my career. And I can link those into what I'm doing now. And, you know, and have that meaning and purpose, I think, for people who sort of stop everything when they retire. I think that can be? Well, I'll tell you, I remember I was working for an organization called the career Foundation, once back in my 20s. And I remember there was this gentleman who he volunteered there. And he had been a high school principal. And I said to him, What are you doing hanging out here, like you're retired, like, you've been a principal, and he said, You know what he said, I retired. And I took two years to do all the things I wanted to do. Any sudden I did them all. Like, I checked off everything that he wanted to do. And then he got bored. He was like, Okay, what am I going to do now. And that was a way for him to give back was to be part of this, this career Foundation. And so I think it can be really healthy for us to keep that meaning and purpose and keep that engagement like what is it that? Where can you use your strengths? And where can you find those moments of flow as well?

Yeah, reminds me of that book from long ago, The Purpose Driven Life. I don't know if you've ever heard of it. But I do feel that sometimes in a job, you have to force yourself to get out of bed, sometimes. But isn't it amazing when you want to get out of bed because you have a mission, you have a purpose, you have this like fire in you to serve in a way that maybe is new and different. And as you were speaking, I think of many other women who maybe aren't retired, but it is down the road. And maybe there's something they want to plant seeds in now, just to get their feet wet, maybe look into it. And because when you're it gives a new light, it gives hope for when you're retiring, because I know it can be quite dramatic for some people. It

really can. And I'm actually stepping more into this work now, where I'm helping people, something I've always done, but helping people to figure out you know, what brings them the most fulfillment in their lives and designing a life that they love. And one of the things I would say is not to wait for retirement, if you can. And one of the stories that has really informed the work that I do and where where my passion. A big part of where it comes from is when I was 24 years old. So recently after graduating from university, my dad who I was very, very close with. He died very suddenly have a massive heart attack at the age of 65. And it was two weeks after he retired. And so many people came up to me and said, you know, it was sad because he was only 65. Right? And so there was that but so many people kept saying oh and just when he had retired or to says he was about to retire or you know just as he was retiring And I was like, What are they talking about? Like it's a tragedy yes, that He died at 65. But what is all this took in my 24 year old brain? I'm like, what is all this talk about? Oh, just when he was about to retire, and then I kind of read between the lines, and I realized, oh, people are saying this because they think, like, probably the majority of people, you're putting your time in until you're 65. And then when I retire, I'm going to do what I want to do with my life. And I started having to say to people, oh, no, but wait, like, my dad wasn't like that. Like, he actually lived in three different countries. And he had different careers, and he started businesses. And he did, you know, he had us kids, and he did what he wanted to do in his life. And so I felt like I had to like correct people that, you know, he wasn't one of those people who waited till he retired to live his life. And the lesson to me, and the message I want to always convey to your listeners, people, whenever I'm speaking to people is that, like, Thank God, my dad wasn't one of those people that was waiting till he was 65 until retirement to live his life. Could you imagine? Yes, that would have been a tragedy. It would have been like all of what those people were saying would have made sense if he was waiting to live his life. Because if he'd waited, he would have been out of luck, right? So if you have a dream in your heart, if you have something that you really want to be doing, if you can swing it, you know, even if it's a side hustle, or something else you do to not wait for retirement, because, you know, tomorrow isn't promised. And I there's an another quote I always think of it's Oliver Wendell Holmes, that most man I like to say most people, not just men, but most people go to their graves with their song on song. Yeah. And I think that if you can find and then linking it to positive psychology and engagement, flow and meaning and purpose that you know, and and looking at, you know, you Linda, and all the work you do in the world, like it's like listening to that message, like start a podcast or start your own business. And I think, you know, it's really beautiful, like you, you had that big career and then moved into this work that really is part of your heart as well. And so I really encourage people, if you can, to not wait.

The only moment we have is now it's the only guaranteed moment. And I love how you say that you bring a wealth of compassion, empathy and knowledge into into your practice. I love how you shared everything. And you've, you seem like you and I know I've listened to your podcast, you're very inspirational and I love what I really love about you is that you bring in the the knowledge base and the science and you blend them two together because some times people need to hear a little bit of statistics or a study that's done to confirm what we know but just kind of legitimize it you know, and I appreciate that.

Thank you. Thank you for noticing that and I do I take pride I like to talk about you know personal anecdotes and things like that but I also like to back things up with science as well I'm a bit of a geek that way I'm a bit of a science nerd so but so I love the self help out I love the science so so it's beautiful to be to me when we can bring those two together so thank you for that.

Okay, great well I love that you are able to share your time here with us on a call for love and just to let the listeners know how they can reach you of course you have your wonderful podcast she flourishes and if you are a call for love listener is going to be so unlined as you can tell Brenda and I are quite similar soul sisters as you could say.

For sure. Absolutely. Yeah. So yeah, they can check out the she flourishes podcast or or they can connect with me on Instagram to I'm at at underscore, Brenda, Jasmine and Jasmine does not have an E on the end. So I would love to Yeah, I'd love to have some of you take a listen. And Linda, you've been on my podcast too so people can can listen to you over there as well.

Yes, absolutely. We're going to swap podcasts because I think that it's such a beautiful flow. And I love this we have done our we have built that connection and that relationship so and I hope other listeners are really taking heed of this wisdom and inspiration because we are here to support and you know, just be loving kind to each other right?

Beautiful. That's what it's all About Absolutely.

Yeah. Well thank you so much. And listeners always wishing you great peace and love from my heart to yours. Namaste.

Namaste. Thank you for having me, Linda.

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