Ready to Grow, Leverage, and Scale Your Business? Come Play with Us! - Ann Ljungberg

Welcome back to your brain on positive. All the love and support you need is residing inside of you. And we're going to make it easier to turn it on.

Oh, welcome back, we are excited that you're here, your brain on positive and I am positive that you are going to love my guest today, one of my favorite people in the world. Ann Ljungberg came into and it's not little bay, it's human Bay. And I will practice this and get it right. So, and we've been in each other's worlds for a few years. And each time we do something together, magic happens, I expect this to be no different. I'm going to let you introduce yourself other than I want people to know that multi faceted relationships can work. Because you and I keep shifting between mentor and student.

Yeah, that was just what I was going to say. Because that's that's how our relationship has been going on all the time. It started with my big off for you, as an amazing speaker really engaging at a couple of events that we met together. And it's been a few years we've been working together. I've been coaching you, you've been coaching me. And I'm so so thrilled to be on here.

I'm so so yeah, so let's we're gonna get this moving fairly quickly for people because we are talking about the hottest topic in the business world today, which is us scale. Most people have no clue what it means they don't know how to get started. And we're going to take them on that journey. So this is really exciting for me, because you know, that's where I am with what I'm doing now. So, I'm going to invite you to share your story of how you understand, Okay, how did you come to understand, growing leveraging and scaling.

I started out tiny, tiny, tiny. Living on a sailboat, leaving my corporate job, where I had been a manager, consulting manager, project manager, I had a lot of people working with me. And we just decided my husband and I, let's quit the circus and go cruising around the world. And that's 20 years ago, we actually left my home country of Sweden. And we haven't stopped yet. After about one year, of doing nothing but touristing and visiting monuments and having great parties with other cruisers. We knew we wanted to keep this lifestyle going. But I also knew that I did not want to be the eternal tourist. I did not want to retire at 40. I needed an intellectual challenge. And I started sort of going through everything I had the knowledge to do everything I wanted to do everything I had a passion for. And I ended up in my childhood passion of writing. So I decided, yeah, I'm going to be a writer here, I'm going to write articles for boating magazines, and pretty quickly realized that writing two articles a year for boating magazine that's not going to keep us fat and happy on the boat. But things started moving. I started working with publishers, I started helping people refine finished novels. And fast forward. I was the most thought after writing coach in Sweden. I was the first to start with but I had a waiting list for six months. I was working with one full length novel manuscript every week and doing other stuff and living and I was getting a little worn out. In the meantime, people had asked me and I want your job. How did you get this? It's so wonderful. You can travel the world and read books and get paid for it. I decided that I wanted to create a training where I could teach people my method of how to go over manuscript and make it publishable.

So, okay, so I'm gonna

jump into this one because this is where our journeys are parallel and a lot of ways you didn't Start out to build a big business you started out to keep yourself in the game and intellectually challenged and do something that you really, really love.

Yes, absolutely. And to add a few items to the cruising kitty, so we could keep going. I started out earning in books. And we went over to cash a while later, the

power of starting out earning in books, which I think is funny. And I so get it. Yeah. Because it wasn't about building a business. At first, it was about following a passion. Yes. And when you decided to start teaching, I will make a guess that some of the people you were teaching were author, they were there, they just they got you faster in a group program than they would have if they'd stayed on your waiting list.

Absolutely. They were already on my email list. Most of them, some were referred by people who are on my list. And yeah,

yeah, I just I want to bring this into the language that is being bandied about without any definition in the coaching world right now. What what you're describing is taking something that works, you working with authors on their books, and getting them finished working one on one, and doing what is being called leveraging, take it into a group program. And I know it ended up being a certification program. And that's the piece that everybody wants to talk about is how do you scale? How do you multiply yourself, but you've got to start with leverage, you have to start with being able to handle a group dynamic. Because you're going to have to teach other people how to do that. And so leverage was, is always the next step. I've never more and then we're gonna continue your story. Because you may know people who've done what I was about to say to not be done. So before I put a limitation out into the world that does not necessarily need to be there. Please continue. All right. So now you're teaching group programs. And then what?

Yeah, well, I had all these people coming into my program saying, Yes, I want to be this type of literary consultant doing developmental editing. So teach me and I had been pondering for you guys, how would I do this? Teach people one on one having them walks beside me? Or it dawned to me, no, we're doing this in a group. And you guys are actually going to be doing case studies, the whole group is going to work with one authors manuscript. And we're going to read this individually, you'll get your time, and then we'll discuss it. And we'll discuss what you have been suggesting to the writer. And we'll add just it because we're learning from the rest of the people of the group too. And that way, for every manuscript we were working with, the group had this common knowledge and a base foundation that we knew we have the quality base here, because my certified students know exactly what to look for. And a successful novel

is, isn't that a cool idea? Isn't that a cool idea? Everybody wins, you were still serving your one on one clients, and actually a higher level because they were getting more brains. They weren't getting these

words. They were definitely getting more brain. I was thinking in the middle of that program, getting goosebumps and had 12 people in the group. These people are getting 12 times better than I ever was at this. And that made me proud. It didn't make me scared. It didn't make me think, well, I'm losing my job, because I'm teaching this.

Yeah. What's interesting is that attitude, and so many people are afraid to teach other people their methodologies for fear that they will lose their job that they will lose their market share that they will lose their ability to you know that they'll be creating competition in the marketplace. Well, the joke is that you can put yourself out of business, you could potentially flood a market, especially in a very specific niche. The reality is that it forces you to evolve.

Absolutely, and I, I evolved together with my students, we created a better method together. When I started out, I was all by myself. There were a handful of people doing sort of the same thing I was doing in my small country of Sweden, but we never talked to each other. We never shared our secrets. So I was Almost getting a little jealous with my groups who could share who became the best peer network, they didn't become competitors. And I was really, that was my big part of running the group, I did not want to create competitors. I kept doing this program, and I'm still doing it. And by now, it's, like 100 people in Sweden, which is a small country, and I'm bringing this program, internationally, end of this year, there is

there are so many books being published every single day right now. And the vast majority of them are in dire need of help. Yeah, I pick up books all the time that I'm like, already, you know, it's not good quality writing, I can't follow the story. And I finally just quit reading fiction at all, because it was so challenging for me.

And many times, it's because people are focusing on the marketing part, instead of actually getting quality in your books. And that goes for fiction and nonfiction. Oh, absolutely. It's all about marketing. And it's a really, really important aspect of publishing. But my main focus has always been the quality of the content.

If you want repeat readers, just like in any business, if you want repeat customers, you have to focus on the quality of the customer experience with you first and foremost. So this is okay, so the journey, we're, we could get lost in the literary conversation that, yeah, let's talk about what this does for someone's business. Because we promised that we would be talking about scaling success. And I think it begs the question, What did success look like to you, when you started scaling? When you started creating many me's, you know, the the many ads out there?

Oh, they're the relief. To start with, I did not have to read a novel manuscript a week anymore. And working on that, I was getting my ears, the my eyes couldn't take it anymore. And now I had all these people to refer to. And I knew that they could do it, because I had them doing case studies and proving it over and over and over before I left them out to do the sharp work with with authors. And they were wonderful. And they were passionate. And every single one of them passed the certification and went out there, knowing not only the skills, but how to market and run this type of business. So I really had an overwhelming tribe of experts. Well, that's

huge. What you just said is huge, because it is the missing link in most certification programs, that they not only knew the skill, they knew the skill of business.

And I think that's such a big part. And especially in my country, even if they go to a coaching, education, taking the international coaching, certification. And, you know, there's so many of those, they don't learn anything about marketing, marketing and running a business. And those are two they have no clue, right? Well,

I experienced it, you know, I'm a multi certified expert. So I came through certification program after certification program in both healing arts and in business skills, even in business skills. They taught a skill, or a technology or a tool, but not the business of being in business, which is a huge mindset shift for most of us.

Yeah. So for my program, 1/3 was the marketing and running a business.

Makes perfect sense. Makes perfect sense. So we're going to talk about how this applies to everybody listening. I'm going to assume that if someone is listening to this podcast, they have something they want to change in the world, they have you, you all talk to you guys, you have impact you want to make. That's why you're listening. So taking the impact that you could have working one on one, finding what aspects of that work, you can teach one to many, or that you could teach people to do what you do. And the reason I said we were on such a parallel track is because as you know my own certification program for my coaches only came about because my one on one clients pushed me Teach them how to do what I do. Yeah, that's it. If it wasn't for them pushing on me those early manuscripts of my certification program that had gathered dust for eight years, we'd still be gathering dust.

Yeah, I mean, same here, I had all these people asking me. And then after I taught one group, two groups, three groups, just keep going, I realized, I have this tribe of people doing my method, and I have new doors opening for me. What's next for me? It might creating? Yeah.

Yeah, well, for you, okay. So your path, I know, you are not only taking your business internationally, and helping people around the world become literary consultants, with high skill levels and the ability to run a business. Okay, got that. But you also accepted the challenge of helping people like me, who had this knowledge, and I had the knowledge, got great results with my clients, I had a demand, my clients wanted me to teach them, what I didn't have was any sense of certainty that my skill level was transferable. And I could do leverage, I could teach a group. But scale requires a transference of skills. And I did not know that was possible. And it really helped me a great deal to have a guide. And I love the fact that that guide was used. So this is how we keep going back and forth with each other. I invite everybody to imagine what your life would be like, if you're young, if you could have these kinds of multifaceted relationships, that you were not afraid of learning from someone who you were also teaching, and you were not afraid. And you were working with people who were not afraid of you teaching them something, if you were also learning something from them, it changes visitors from from being transactional, to being nurturing to being community building. And I love the way you call it a peer network. What would a peer network because for me, my definition of success is to be involved in these kinds of communities in peer networks, other people who are willing to take a risk and transfer their skills to the to a larger group of people to be able to literally scale the impact that the work has on the world.

What's been the biggest challenge?

A really big challenge for me was following my passion thinking, if I could do this for myself, I can do this for others. And why don't I just start doing it internationally, by the way? So I went out there in the world and said, Hey, guys, do you want to create a certification program I can teach you. So there was from nowhere, reaching out to North Americans? That was a challenge. But we speak a different language. Yeah.

We do an entrepreneurial ism. In America, where I'm in, I'm in Florida, you know, it has a different vibe now. Because there are so many programs out there that are literally promising the moon. And not a lot of them are delivering the moon. So the power of what we're going to talk about now, which is the nitty gritty of how do you go from being the person who knows what you know, to being the person who can transfer those skills to other people, and build bigger impact actually build movements? So the nitty gritty? What's step one?

Step one is you know, that you can create great results for your clients. You have clients who love you who refer you and you may might even be overwhelmed by having too many clients and not being able to serve everyone who needs you.

I'm gonna say get good at what you do. Get good so that you know you're good. So yeah, you yourself first.

Absolutely. What I'm helping people with is definitely not a quick fix, like, learn how to create a certification program and you'll become a millionaire if you don't have a skill already. If you don't have your expert method or your expert coaching, healing, whatever a method or skill or service you If you don't have that, I can't help you.

I think this is just a really solid place to start and to stay for a couple of minutes. When I first started talking with you about this, because of my clients, I had to go through this, okay, wait a minute, why would I, how can I do this nothing I teach is unique, nothing I do is unique. I'm certified, and all of these different things. And what I do with my clients is an amalgam of all of these things. It's a combination, it's where I've taken you some from column A, and some from column B, and I explain it with my own stories. It didn't feel like it was mine, and that I have a right to teach it. And that was the first conversation, I had to go through some mindset stuff with you to go, what makes this different that nobody else is doing it this way.

That's true. I mean, you have a lot of expertise, but there's always the confidence but like, am I stealing something from someone, if I'm using this as part of my toolkit, and what I've created, you know, I finally need to go back and ask, but

yeah, we're actually doing was amazing, because it sort of boils down to, are any of the parts still recognizable as something, you know, that I got out of a book, or I got out of a certification program, or any of them recognizable? And the answer is no, because it's not that it's, it's now this is like, people talk about inner child work. And, you know, what we're doing is actually empowering the inner child. So it's inner child empowerment work is one piece of this. And it doesn't look anything like inner child work now. Yeah, that's a very different process, very different technique. And I'm like, Oh, now I get it. It.

We call it transformed, you know, more, something else? And yeah, so I'm going to invite everybody who is already going, I can't do this, because I've got all the answers, take a deep breath, look at what you're using, that may have roots may have been inspired by. And that has transformed in some way. There are a couple of techniques that I use that are time honored techniques, and yet I was introduced to them by very specific people. And so I just give credit where credit is due, even though I know they did not invent them. Because I can find them. Yeah, they're just the ones who introduced them to me. So I give credit that way now, and it solved all of my problems.

Yeah. Just an analogy to what I've been doing. I could have told the people who were on my very first webinar where I introduced my training to become a literary consultant is you could actually read these 400 books about writing. And you could watch these 200 webinars and courses and start, you know, giving away free services to test a few clients before you get in there. I will give you the shortcut. Because I've been through all that. I've created a method out of that. And I know that what I'm doing is providing results for my clients. That's what I'm giving you

get good get confident that what you're doing provides results for your clients get clear, is I think the the second step here, get good get confident about the fact that you're good. And then get clear about how what you do saves other people time. Yes. And how it saves other people time where it saves them time getting the outcome they want. I think this is really back to success. You got to know what outcome your peeps want and what outcome you deliver. So that you can make sure they're in alignment before you launch a certification program. And that was that was the the third step that was the the big aha moment for me in launching mine was was understanding what success would look like.

And once you know what that looks like, you know what kind of results you want your students to present. You also have to look inside yourself thinking What have I never been telling my clients, but I've been helping them work through this. This issues this problems, they're getting the results but there's so much inside me in with my material, my knowledge that I'm never showing them, but I'm going to have to show this to teach this to the students who are taking my certification program.

Yeah, what my clients aren't aware of that my students are going to have to master

here. So that's really filling the gap between how you're working your method, and what you really know, deep down down your spine. And I meet so many coaches who say, Oh, well, I'm working with intuition. And this may be true, but there's something that you can structure that on and create a method out of it. So absolutely. And I was saying, I can't help you if you don't have a method. Actually, I can't. Because if you have results with your clients, and you've never structured as a method, I'll help you do that.

So the reality is you have a massive amount of free resources available to people on your website. And that's all going to be in the show notes. So people who are curious about do I have a method is what I'm doing considered a method. There's free resources on Dan's website, that you can go and start figuring those things out if you're looking to scale. Now, I started to say earlier in our conversation, that you can't go from one on one to scale that you really need to go through leveraging first teaching to a group

first. Now I'm going is that true? I'm not sure. Well,

you could do a certification one on one. But honestly, I'm not crazy about the certification programs, you will find online while people are answering a few questions, usually multi multiple required replay questions, getting one right, passing through series of questions, and then bam, you're certified. There are, yeah, there are quite a few certifications that I have that have been like that. And I have learned from it. But if I am an entrepreneur who worked my way up to this, go to expert level, I want to be able to trust the people that I'm teaching, I want to look them in the eye, I want to be coaching them. So that's what I'm teaching my clients. Also, if you are the go to expert on something, work with people that you really trust and that you can coach during your program. Mm hmm. If you created a very solid software that you want people certified on Sure, you could do that. AP tests thing. But I think we're as entrepreneur experts, we really want the confidence and we want to instill the confidence in the people we train.

Yeah, that's a big point to highlight. Because it's about creating a certification program. It's crowding, it's about creating scale that keeps the integrity of the work intact. So yeah, if it's mastering a technical skill, one technical skill, one kind of software, you can test for that. And absolutely, you're a certified whatever expert. But when it comes to the softer skills, when it comes to the intuition, when it comes to coaching, when it comes to guiding when it comes to healing, when it comes to these modalities that have this huge impact in the world, maintaining the integrity of the work keeping some guidelines in place, and that was a big aha, for me, is the number of certifications that I have, they did not have that in place that whether you call it a continuing education program, whether you call it a quality control. Yeah. And because I've helped people work behind the eyes in between the years with limiting beliefs and cleaning up emotional negative emotional history. And that's what I teach coaches how to do and do it so well. They can guarantee results. This requires me to have some quality control in place. And you the ability to say okay, what would that look like the kinds of questioning? We're going to keep it back to somebody just starting out, get good, know that you're good. Then what is it that you do that you know, that you don't tell your clients? Like I don't teach my clients neuroscience? I don't get into the concepts of what makes this empowered inner child work versus is inner child work, I don't get into all of that with my clients, with my coaches, we go there, because I want my coaches to have a solid foundation in how it works, not just the technical skill. So to stick with the analogy of a computer program, what you helped me understand was that they could be technically proficient. But because of the type of work we're doing inside people's heads, they needed to be concept proficient, as well. So not everybody's program is going to need both. But now that I'm understanding more how the brain works, people need more concepts that I used to think. So now I'm actually doing more helping my coaches do more with concepts with their clients, because I found out that the brain requires meaning to actually learn something is missing

five, that's a wonderful thought. And then I add, add in some real life clients, and case studies, because that's where you can practice and practice and practice and go back to you, as an expert, ask the questions, tell them I tried this, but I failed, what did I do wrong? Or I actually tried something a little more. And I had this result, but I might stepping outside of the method now. So you can have that conversation while they're actually working with real life clients and case studies. And instead of just doing the theory,

what made the biggest shift for me was when I said yes to that, because I went back through my own trainings. And it was those trainings that required me to work with what we call practice clients. Those are the ones that stuck. Those are the the things that change me and how I am what I do in the world. And so that's what, following your advice, thank you very much. So I'm going to invite everybody break it, when you're thinking about scaling, you're thinking about cloning yourself, you're thinking about taking what you do, and you have people who want Who asked you to teach them, I don't recommend starting a scale program in less, you'd already know there's a demand for it. This is not the Field of Dreams, guys, we're FYI belt, they will come and study with me ain't happening. When they say I want you to teach me, then you consider this. And so that's my criteria. What do you think?

Oh, exactly. There has to be a demand. And that's going to make you happy, that's going to make your students happy. And all those clients out there that can be helped, so happy. And I also think following up on that, how do you maintain that knowledge that networking, after people are certified, I think that's a huge part of it, actually, keeping a community, helping people to grow together, helping them with those first scary business steps, if this is their first business that you've taught them a profession,

it's more than transferring a skill is about helping others develop a profession, so that they can sustain and support themselves. And brilliant people, and the coaching and healing space are struggling now to sustain and support themselves. And part of it is that they tried to skip that step of getting really good, and knowing that they were good. And every now and then it'll move really fast for someone. Because I'm one of those people that moved really fast. It freaked out everybody around me, because once I decided it was like, boom, here it comes. But what I'm seeing more and more is that people are afraid of taking the risks of doing anything that would possibly give them leverage where they could work one to many or and so they're running into programs that will teach them how to build a group program. They're running to gurus who will teach them how to build their first course online, and they're running scared. They're not running from abundance and not running because I'm ready to leverage they're running because they're so scared not to because this is what everybody is doing. And it concerns me. If they were running because they were ready. They knew they were ready. They were confident they were certain and they wanted some guidance on how to leverage. You know what that marketing might look like what that business might look like. That's one kind of energy. But if they're running towards these programs, because they're afraid of missing out on something, this is what everybody's doing. I'm like, but not everybody has the gift.

Not everybody's business model needs to go that way. What if your first group program was a certification program? Because and that's really what you did. You went from working one on one with clients to creating many us who could work one on one with clients. And you did that as a group, your first group program was a scale program. So you put leverage and scale together, you'd leveraged your time and created a way to scale your business. What I want to encourage everyone is just listen to the fact that you can't do it wrong. Test out how you want to build your business, keep your foundation solid, where you know, you're getting good results for people. And then don't let anyone else tell you how to build your business.

Test. Trust yourself, listen to the feedback you're getting, you will get feedback. And you'll know when you're ready. And I don't know that you know my story. In 2015, I knew I was ready

to start teaching people how to do what I do. And I wrote my first script. And then I got business coaching, and was told I needed to build a program, I ended up writing a book, I ended up in this whole world. And for eight years, I struggled to create programs to teach things that the market wanted.

Because I did a ton of market research the market wanted. But it wasn't my certification.

It was aspects of it, like teaching sales while I teach sales inside my certification program. I mean, people say don't use that word. I'm like, Okay, let's call it service. That always leaves equal, but success behind. So

the acronym of sales, I'm like, I'm going to talk about sales guys. Yeah, if people do not buy from you, you do not have a business, you have a hobby. So sales is important.

But I was teaching that as a standalone skill. And it was so out of integrity for my vision of what success would look like, which was to have a bunch of people who could do the work inside the heads of their clients. You know, it's like, that's why I'm, I'm gonna put it out there. I didn't do anything wrong, guys. Eight years later, I am a lot more certain. Okay, I have a much more solid foundation in the validity of my work. Because I've worked with a bunch more clients. But there's always for me going to be how can I help other people avoid that eight year doing what other people said was

the right business model for me rather than trusting my gut, any less painful.

So I that's why we're doing this conversation. This is guys, this is your wake up call. Maybe it will save you some time, if you realize that you really don't have to wait. If you feel certain of the results that you're getting. Maybe it is time for you to listen is someone asking you to teach them? And if they are, then consider what did success look like to you? What would success look like to them? And is that going to match up with what success looks like to your clients? If you get three yeses in a row, then it might be time to take a look at scaling. Because it has to be in alignment with what success looks like to every one involved. And yes, sales and money will be required.

Absolutely. You might say people come into my certification program, you're learning my method clients like this. But then you go ahead and find your own clients. Yeah, you need a part of that. Teaching them how to do the sales, teaching them how to do the marketing and also not doing the promise that you are guaranteed clients if you come into my program, hold it,

hold it, hold it. I guarantee clients if you come into my program, so well you do yes.I mean, I do. I do. The one thing that most coaching programs don't we guarantee results and I guarantee results in my certification programs. We guarantee results for private clients and guarantee and I know I'm a heretic. I know this is not what's advisable for Are most people. So I'm not suggesting you follow me. But you know, that's my elephant in the room is when I say do it your way, do you? I mean it. For me, it's this was the missing piece in the coaching and healing industry, this certainty of being able to guarantee results. So that's the problem I solve for coaches and healers.

That's not the problem everybody else is going to solve. So they really I think that's the big piece and is make sure that you're solving the problem that people need solved or want solved.

Absolutely. How to find those clients. That's really important.

You know, the, there's so many different ways that clients can be found, or actually more accurately, for most of us, there are so many different ways that clients can find you, which is the way it used to be. I am all okay. Businesses back in the day, we got found in something called the yellow pages, you have to explain to kids how to look up a phone number, and they don't get it now. Yeah, I mean, they used to be found in the Yellow Pages. What did that mean, somebody was looking to solve a problem. And so what did we do we put our business information, where, where people were looking, that is the one skill set that if more people would just go back to their basic and go, if people want to solve this problem that I can solve, where are they looking for that solution? And they just put yourself there? Yes.

Science, people Google same thing, and they find your webpage. And honestly, my first 15 years before I started my certification program, I never advertised, never, I never made cold calls. I had people finding me.

You put yourself in literary author rich environments? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, you just got to go where the people are hanging out who have the problem that you could solve? That's it. Yeah. It but that was lost on me for many years. Because I was in the right environments. I was in environments with a lot of coaches and healers. But I was speaking to the wrong problem.

So getting your problem, your solution, and your people you know it all a in alignment, all in congruence. And that's going to solve a big problem for most people. That's the shortcut to the how of marketing. See if you can get them in alignment, you know, and we have gone all around the mulberry bush as far as scaling for success, and what are some of the landmines? And what are the basics of being willing to be confident enough to just see if it's the right thing for you right now, knowing that for most of the people listening, it is in your future, you will reach a point of maxing out your time doing one on one work, you will reach a point of baby even wanting to retire if you're doing group work. Either way, the only way to continue to have an income to continue to have impact and to leave a legacy is going to be to scale. So consider putting it on your plan. Even if it's not your present day plan. That's my invitation to everyone because that is such a positive vision for your future of your skill, your brilliance not leaving the planet when you do because we all will. So I'm positive and people will get amazing value from our conversation. And they will get amazing value from what they find on the resources that we will have for them in the show notes. Yeah, fantastic. winded up what is the one thing that you want them to know?

If you are an expert who don't feel super, super confident that you can teach other people how to work your method. We're gonna have to edit because I have really had a flow here and I lost it.

We don't edit. So here's gonna be the fun thing. Your flow will come back and I'm a firm believer you don't have to be perfect to be profitable. So you don't have to have a perfect thought to wind this up for people. Yeah,

I do have the thought it came back to me. You might be charging your clients that you're working with now a special amount and you're thinking, Oh, I'm going to be teaching this to my students, don't undersell yourself. Just think about how quickly they will get invest, you know, return on investment by learning your method, by charging the same amount that you were charging or even more, encourage them to raise the prices. This will help the entire market for your skill. So really realize that you are doing a high ticket program with your certification program,

we're going to call that managing the money mindset. If people are paying you a certain amount of money, they will pay your students that much or more, if you hold that value. It's very, very true, because I'm seeing that happen with my students. So it is about declaring your value as as, as transferable, as the skills that you will be teaching with the skills comes to value. Thank you. And that is a very, very important point. All right, thank you. When success comes money, yes, we like your value, know your value. And money is for living the life that you want. It's not just for accumulating money, it is for living the lifestyle that you want and encouraging the world to believe that they can live the lifestyle that they want. Take some effort, and it really helps to have people on the journey with you so and thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for being on this journey with me.

Thank you, Jackie, you have been instrumental to my success.

It's a lot of fun to play.

Sure is. Come play with us, you guys.