EP58: Reclaim Your Self After Narcissistic Abuse with Pi Venus Winslow

This is winning with wellness, a podcast about inspiring the wellness warrior in you. If you are feeling lost or alone in your wellness journey, or are looking for new ideas and inspiration, you are in the right place, a place you can learn about all things wellness in business life and living. Your host Jenny Ryce, we'll be bringing you inspiring stories and practical tools to improve your overall wellness personally and professionally. Imagine what living a life of wellness would be like. Thank you for joining us today. Welcome, everyone. Thank you for tuning in again for another episode of winning with wellness. This is a podcast, as you know that is just anchored in the hope and the intention to inspire the wellness warrior in you. I am really excited to have a guest with me today. Her name is Pi Venus Winslow, welcome, pie.

Thank you, Jenny. I'm so excited to be here.

Oh thrilled to have you here. And I want to share with the audience a little bit about your background. And then we're going to get into that conversation. So everybody pie is a published author, public speaker and transformational life coach for those recovering from a narcissistic upbringing. This actually you guys I'm so excited to dig into this topic, because I think so many of us are afflicted by this and have no idea so, PI's mission actually is to empower others to reclaim their authentic selves and live intentionally free from codependency and narcissistic abuse. So Pi. Welcome to the show.

Thank you. I'm so excited for our conversation today. Oh, me too.

And you know, for many of us listening, the word narcissistic can be kind of terrifying out or out of reach. We're afraid of, you know, you hear it in movies, you see it on, you know, horror movies and things like that. Can you give a little bit of a background so that we can normalize that word a little bit for people? What does narcissistic or Narcissus mean? As it? Yeah, in general?

Yeah, yeah. And I want to I want to agree that narcissism is a term that is becoming more popular these days. And in one way, it's really great because it's bringing an awareness to these dis these dysfunctional ways of being and dysfunctional and toxic behaviors. And also on the flip side, it can be, it can be used to generalize a lot of people, which I think can also take the importance out of what narcissism really is all about. So and we definitely don't want to go around diagnosing people as narcissists. But there are certain traits and behaviors that narcissistic people consistently display. So narcissistic personality disorder is, is a is a disorder, it's an actual medical disorder and condition, and it needs to be diagnosed by a professional. However, like I said, there are consistent traits and behavior that are consistent with that person, disorder. And so on a spectrum, People with this disorder exhibit these behaviors all the time, regularly, it is their personality, and the rest of us, we can display these beaters and characteristics at at any time because we're human beings. And they, you know, everybody can be capable of lying, everybody can be capable of like, wanting to cover things up and look good and maybe, you know, not take responsibility. You know, we can be selfish, we we can, you know, not want to admit that we're wrong. We can put on a mask, you know, and and show ourselves one way but not really be that way. It at other times So, so, we all have in can display narcissistic behaviors, but the difference between true narcissism is the frequency and severity of those behaviors.

That is a beautiful explanation. Because, you know, it's funny, I was like, Oh, if when I knew we were going to connect, I thought I could To dig into this a little bit, and I was like, Okay, so in my lifetime, I've probably done one or two or three of these things. So I'm like, does that mean? So that, you know, that's a great explanation? anybody listening? Don't be alarmed. You're not as narcissist. If you flub the truth once in a while, or, you know, try to evade being, you know, guilty of something.

Yeah, no, it's true. And what I what I always tell people who, who contact me or, or I work with my, in my messages always to other people, it's like, you know, if you, you struggle with these, even noticing these behaviors in yourself, if you grew up with narcissism being normal in your family, it's not your fault, because that's what you learned.

Right? So learned, it's a learned trait. So can you can you talk a little bit about because many people probably listening today, you know, and as parents, as a parent, you know, you're always concerned the imprint you're leaving on your children, so many people listening to you're probably questioning, you know, is that what are my parents? narcissistic? Like, what, what would be some, some signs that people wouldn't be able to relate to? Have they been raised by narcissistic parents or might personally be experiencing because of that?

Yeah. So a narcissistic person, there's, there are several characteristics. And I would say some of the main ones are entitlement. So narcissistic people are extremely entitled, and they, they need to be the center of the universe. Everything needs to be about them, it is about them. And it relates to them in some way. And their wants, and needs and feelings are more important than anything or anyone else. And they want to be admired. They want to be revered. They want to be consulted, they and they want to be appreciated, always. So they have a very, very high entitlement. They're also lacking in empathy and remorse. So they can't really relate to the feelings of and suffering, pain, suffering of other people, they really can't connect to that all. Because of that. They don't have remorse when they hurt other people. And some narcissistic people actually enjoy hurting other people they get, they get a hit a high of power and control, hurting other people. So. So those are big ones. They also believe that they're perfect, and they don't admit to being wrong. They don't they don't give a genuine apology. They give you the faux apology. Right? Right, which actually puts it back on you, right, and it makes them look like the victim. So they don't take responsibility or accountability for their behavior. They are deceptive, and they can why easily compulsively frequent. They will say, and do whatever they need to to manipulate a situation. And they'll twist the facts to their benefit. And they may actually ask you, you know, ask you questions to gain your trust and gather information about you that they can then use against you later. It's almost kind of

emotional, emotional exploitation. They're also a wolf in sheep's clothing. So again, the mask the in a nick, they show up as generous and kind and charming and charismatic, and then everybody thinks they're wonderful. And then behind the scenes to other people, usually family or loved ones, or you know, co workers. They they are cruel, abusive acts, they exploit people, they're manipulative. And this is really challenging because victims of narcissists often struggle with getting other people to believe them because the narcissist acts so convincing in front of other people that their behavior is questioned. Other people can't believe it. They're like, Oh, you know that. That can't be true. I know that person, you must be mistaken. So that can be really chatty. lunging especially if Well, if you grow up if your parents, you know, your parents are behaving that way. And you know, like, if you're a child, people are more likely to believe you're, you know what they see, and thinking, you know, oh, no parent would do that or, you know, that wouldn't do that. narcissists. Also they demand emotional energy. So they're like a vampire, they literally are like, the the soul sucking energy vampire, you know, like a vampire is and all of the stories, so they feed on other people's emotional energy, and they need attention, and they need validation. And they can get that through any emotional reaction, whether it's positive or negative. So this, this energy feed them and they can't live without it. They're really they're addicted to it. And so this is known as narcissistic supply, okay, and then they will attach if denied their narcissistic supply. So they will resort to, they can resort to physical abuse, emotional abuse, psychological abuse, sexual abuse, financial abuse, anything to diminish their victim and make them feel more powerful and better about themselves. And this is known as narcissistic rage. So those are the main characteristics some of the major mystics of narcissism.

That's incredible. So when we, you know, I'm sure right now we have somebody listening, going like Holy smokes, I think I was raised in a narcissistic environment, or maybe I'm working in a narcissistic environment, or I'm in love with a narcissist, that could happen to what would be just so we can give some people some tangible things, what would be one or two steps or, you know, action plans that you would suggest for people in on a pathway to healing or moving into a new direction to change their pathway?

Yeah, um, I would say, Well, I think you know, just educating yourself on, you know, signs of unhealthy and toxic relationships. So given anything that I've already told you, if you're like, Wow, this is a consistent pattern with somebody in my life, I think getting education about it, and also distancing yourself from that person. So definitely having strong boundaries, and getting away from that type of behavior is going to help you to first of all, calm your nervous system, because whenever we're whenever abused, and treated that way, our our amygdala fires up, right, our survival brain over and we're not really able to think clearly, right? And I think this is why it can be so confusing for victims because they're like, we can't make sense of it. And because we're in a triggered state, we don't really know exactly how to respond to it. And then when we start calming down, if, you know, if the narcissist is telling us, it's our fault, you know, when things happen that way, or they're gaslighting us and they're saying, I never said that, that didn't happen, then then we we might, we will diminish our own experience. Right? And you know, and we'll stay, you know, we'll stay in that pattern. So getting away from that, giving ourselves some distance, and then bringing the focus back to ourselves and being on our own self care. And taking notes, you know, reminding ourselves like, yeah, that actually really did happen. And I'm not crazy. Right. So, yeah, yeah. And so, and managing our own PTSD, like we all have, we've all had trauma in our lives. And I think for some of us, you know, if we've experienced consistent abuse, and we, you know, like on a regular basis that does or really intense abuse, it can cause yesterday but it could also go long term can call cause that complex, PTSD and so like Pete for people like me, who grew up constantly in a state of survival when I became an adult, I went that way too. And I didn't know how to manage my fear of perceived threats, how to calm my body down, how to even process my feelings, because I had never been taught how to do that. And my my baseline was, was was that heightened state of, you know, being in danger. So create boundaries, managing PTSD, and, you know, re parenting or parenting ourselves in a loving way. Acknowledging that sometimes we don't have, well, we don't have control over what other people say and do, but, you know, agonizing that we're not responsible for other people's behavior, but we are responsible for what we choose to do. And, and the choices that we make. So if you're being abused, or you're in an abusive situation, you deserve to get yourself out of that situation, regardless of who that person is.

And I think, you know, for anybody that's listening, right now, if this is this is a green light you need this is the green light, because I think, you know, Pisces, share it so beautifully. When you're in it, you can't even see that it's happening sometimes, right? You don't even know especially if you are a product of that from your, your childhood. And then you find yourself in a relationship, let's say I'm mn just using this, you know, projection. Once you're in a relationship, it's more of what you know, you don't even realize that you're, you're in it. So when you when you say to somebody gets space, obviously, you're gifted, this is what you do you help people through this? Is this a journey that people can take alone? I know, it would be easy with support, I think it's, it can be very scary to step out of what your normal is, and get on your own two feet, because you don't know the difference yet. Other than hiring someone like yourself or seeking support, what would be some other other tools you would recommend for people?

Yeah, well, I mean, I think well, back to what you were originally saying that people can do this on their own. There are some things yes, you can do on your own, but I really believe that we, we need support from other people. And for so many people, myself included, I you know, growing up in believing I had to do everything myself, and I had to figure everything out by myself. And like you said, when we're in it, we don't see it. So getting outside support and outside perspective from people who are trustworthy and and love you and can can validate your experience and cans for you in creating that space, you know, to get a to get away from the situation and get, you know, get a perspective on it and come up with a plan. I think that, you know, I think that worthiness is really the key, it's like when I distill it all down, when I think about my life and my experiences and what I struggled with and what other people struggle with, it really comes down to worthiness, it comes down to believing that we we deserve to have a good life that we we deserve to be treated with respect. And until we treat our girls with that respect, and that love and that that commitment, we will not find that we will not find that other people do that as well. So So really the deeper issue, it's almost like, like the toxic relationships are really just an external manifestation of what's going on internally. So looking at it looking at ourselves inside it's like well, why why do I believe that? I don't you know, that I don't deserve to be treated better or why do I believe I need to stay in this relationship? Why? What is it in me that is dependent on this, this other person to give me something that I could be being myself?

And you know, I love that you tap into that because really, it all everything. Everything in life stems from within you We people treat us how we allow them to treat us. And sometimes it takes a, like a catalyst or a moment where we're like, I'm not going to do this anymore. And it's terrifying. But the reward at the end, the discovery, I mean, you know, you're sitting here living proof of changing your trajectory. Right? I mean, you're in network because of your own journey, correct?

Absolutely, absolutely. And and I want to say, you know, to people who are listening, like it's never too late to, to move and change the change the course of your life in your destiny. So I was 45 years old, before I finally got to a point, like you said, I hit that catalyst where, like, the truth just hit me upside, the head is so hard. I was like, there was just no denying it. I was like, Alright, I'm diving into this stuff. I don't know how I don't know. You know, I don't, I know, it's probably going to be painful. I don't know what to expect. I have resistance, I'm scared. And I cannot afford to keep living my life this way. I'm done. So that was the beginning of my journey. And I really believe that everything that happens in our lives is happening for a reason. And that's what it took for me to finally, you know, like, surrender. Yeah, and do this in our work. So it's never too late.

I love that you say that it is never It is never too late. It is never too late. So we're getting close to our time pi. If there when you think about our conversation, and I you know, what, if what's something that I haven't asked you yet that you want to ensure that the listeners hear before we, before we close out our time together?

Oh, the journey? Well, what I want to say is, you know, the journey is worth it. That's absolutely worth it. And I, I personally had no idea what was possible in that thing. And knowing how it was going to unfold, but trusting the process and trusting in our you know, the higher, the higher universal wisdom, you know, that that is created this universe that we live in with all of its synchronicities, and magical moments where things just start lining up. When we when we dive into this journey, and we trust the process, and we learn how to ourselves, and we learn how to start trusting other people, trustworthy people, then everything starts to fall into place. And I wish that somebody had told me that back in the beginning, I might I might not have had so much resistance. And I might not have had to take so many hits upside that from the universe. But I you know, eventually I got the message. And so, so yeah, I think I think just touching on the power of trusting the process and the journey of healing. And it's not, it's not so much a destination as it is, you know, that that process of the journey and learning along the way, and I'm not done learning. I'm not done healing. I'm not done growing and expanding. I still get to keep doing that. It's just it's it is a continual journey. And it will be until the day I die. So so don't be afraid to free to start don't be afraid to decide to make a change in your life. If there's something in your life that's not working.

So powerful because life is a journey. The finish line doesn't exist, thankfully. Right? You're sharing your vulnerability and you know pie you wrote about this right? You don't you have a free you have a free offer for everybody that's listening. Correct. And that's a digital copy of your book. Is

that right? That's right. That's yes,

we're gonna obviously put this information in the show notes. But would you mind sharing a little bit about what that's about? Because it's extremely generous for for our listeners?

Yeah, yeah. Thank you. Um, so on. In the beginning of my journey, I decided to to write about my experiences. And as I moved through my journey, the book that I wrote developed along the way and so my book is called Mother Medusa, weaving myths and magic into healing from a narcissistic upbringing and you can get a free digital copy have that book and in it I talk about my experience growing up with a narcissistic mother the effects that it had on me and how I learned how to heal through through the heroines journey or the hero's journey that is in that is reflected in, in myth and stories of, of humankind and implementing ritual in my life, which was a healing practice, transformed my life magically into this incredible life that I'm living right now,

when I love, and thank you for paving the way to show people as possible.

Thank you, thank you. It's been, it's been an honor and a privilege to be on this journey even and even more, so to share it with other people. So thank you for this opportunity to have this conversation today.

Oh, thank you for being here. And thank you, listeners for showing up today. Wherever you may be joining us from, we appreciate you, we value you. And we know that you are not alone in your journey, whatever that looks like. Just know that we're walking alongside you. We're all experiencing it. We're all human, and we're all learning to live our best life. Don't hesitate to join us at your holistic Earth where you can connect with more like minded people. Again, Pi. Thank you so much for being here.

Thank you, Jenny.

And thank you listeners. Looking forward to catching you on our next episode. We are so excited and honored to inspire the wellness warrior you. Thanks so much.