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The title does not do Kiefer Jones justice. At the age of 32 years of age, Kiefer has already served almost ten years in the U.S. Airforce and, after leaving he continued to do the same job as a contractor. For the last part of his air Force career, he worked in Europe and continued that work din Europe during the pandemic. In late January of 2022 Kiefer experienced a serious snowboarding accident in Austria. The result was that he had a skull that was fractured in 14 places, a traumatic brain injury, all the ribs on the right side of his body were broken, and he suffered a broken back. After being in a coma for several weeks he regained consciousness and began a long road to recovery to the amazement of his doctors. He has recovered so much that recently he ran his first 5K marathon. He attributes much of his comeback to what he calls “positive adaptability”. We spend a great deal of time discussing this concept including Kiefer giving suggestions as to why it should be important to all of us and how we can adopt our own positive adaptability mindset. No doubt that Kiefer is an unstoppable individual by any definition. In addition to continuing to do government contract work in Virginia where he lives, he and his wife Christine, (she prefers simply Tine), own a company called Tiki designs. The company produces what the Jones’ call “digital story telling”. You get to hear all about it during our episode. Sit back, relax and be prepared to be inspired and encouraged. About the Guest: Kiefer Jones is a 32-year-old United States Air Force veteran originally from the small town of Decatur, Indiana. He considers himself to be an honest, positively adaptable, and intrinsically motivated world traveler with a passion to bring ideas to life and use creativity to communicate, tell stories, resolve problems, and ignite innovation. He is currently living in Alexandria, Virginia with his wife and 2 cats after having had the unique opportunity to live and work in Europe for the last 7 years supporting the United States Air Force and the government. Almost 2 years ago, he was in a terrible snowboarding accident that put him in a coma for 7 days and left him with a broken spine, shoulder, and fractured his skull into 14 pieces which resulted in a traumatic brain injury, leaving him permanently blind in his right eye. Despite this new challenge, he remains a passionate organizational agility leader, people and process tuner, creator, project manager, and scrum master with 10+ years of experience in the creative and information technology industries. He is also a long-time musician with a professionally produced album out on Spotify, iTunes, and the other digital music platforms. He considers himself an effective facilitator and adroit communicator with a focus on teams, value, and outcomes over outputs. Kiefer and his wife, Tine, are co-owners and digital creators for their own company, TiKi Design, where they've garnered engagement and business for viral accounts and clients resulting in over 120K new followers and generated more than 20 million new views and over 4 million new likes. They are enjoying building a new life in America. Ways to connect with Kiefer: Here is a link to a case study I published regarding implementing scrum and kanban within the Air Force: https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/us-air-force-overcome-scrum-jones-agility-leader-creative-pmp/ Our media business: https://tikidesignproductions.com/about
Department of Defense news article from Stars and Stripes covering my road to recovery: https://www.stripes.com/theaters/europe/2022-05-11/former-ramstein-airman-on-the-road-to-recovery-after-horrific-snowboarding-accident-in-italy-5965528.html About the Host: Michael Hingson is a New York Times best-selling author, international lecturer, and Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe. Michael, blind since birth, survived the 9/11 attacks with the help of his guide dog Roselle. This story is the subject of his best-selling book, Thunder Dog. Michael gives over 100 presentations around the world each year speaking to influential groups such as Exxon Mobile, AT&T, Federal Express, Scripps College, Rutgers University, Children’s Hospital, and the American Red Cross just to name a few. He is Ambassador for the National Braille Literacy Campaign for the National Federation of the Blind and also serves as Ambassador for the American Humane Association’s 2012 Hero Dog Awards. https://michaelhingson.com https://www.facebook.com/michael.hingson.author.speaker/ https://twitter.com/mhingson https://www.youtube.com/user/mhingson https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelhingson/ accessiBe Links https://accessibe.com/ https://www.youtube.com/c/accessiBe https://www.linkedin.com/company/accessibe/mycompany/ https://www.facebook.com/accessibe/ Thanks for listening! Thanks so much for listening to our podcast! If you enjoyed this episode and think that others could benefit from listening, please share it using the social media buttons on this page. Do you have some feedback or questions about this episode? Leave a comment in the section below! Subscribe to the podcast If you would like to get automatic updates of new podcast episodes, you can subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts or Stitcher. You can also subscribe in your favorite podcast app. Leave us an Apple Podcasts review Ratings and reviews from our listeners are extremely valuable to us and greatly appreciated. They help our podcast rank higher on Apple Podcasts, which exposes our show to more awesome listeners like you. If you have a minute, please leave an honest review on Apple Podcasts. Transcription Notes:
Michael Hingson ** 00:00 Access Cast and accessiBe Initiative presents Unstoppable Mindset. The podcast where inclusion, diversity and the unexpected meet. Hi, I'm Michael Hingson, Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe and the author of the number one New York Times bestselling book, Thunder dog, the story of a blind man, his guide dog and the triumph of trust. Thanks for joining me on my podcast as we explore our own blinding fears of inclusion unacceptance and our resistance to change. We will discover the idea that no matter the situation, or the people we encounter, our own fears, and prejudices often are our strongest barriers to moving forward. The unstoppable mindset podcast is sponsored by accessiBe, that's a c c e s s i capital B e. Visit www.accessibe.com to learn how you can make your website accessible for persons with disabilities. And to help make the internet fully inclusive by the year 2025. Glad you dropped by we're happy to meet you and to have you here with us. Michael Hingson ** 01:21 Hi there and welcome to another episode of unstoppable mindset where inclusion diversity in the unexpected meet unexpected as a whole lot more fun than inclusion and diversity. And we'll probably get to a lot of that today. Anyway, our guest is Kiefer Jones Kiefer is 32 years old. So his bio says he was in the Air Force. He's faced some physical challenges along the way. I think it was all just to get attention, but he can tell us about it. I know that was no fun wasn't Kiefer. But anyway, I want to welcome you to unstoppable mindset. We're really glad you're here. Kiefer Jone ** 01:58 Thank you, Michael. And thank you so much for having me happy to be a guest. And I've been looking forward to this all week, sir. Michael Hingson ** 02:03 Well, tell me a little bit about maybe the younger key for growing up and all that and sort of how you got started or whatever. 02:10 Oh, ah, yeah, that Michael Hingson ** 02:11 was I know that opens it that takes an hour but go to it. No, yeah. So Kiefer Jone ** 02:16 what can I say I'm I'm a small town, Indiana kid. I grew up in a tiny little town called Decatur, Indiana. It's a one stoplight town. I am the oldest son of three boys in a single mother. So single mom household. Yeah, I grew up there and started off my life in this tiny one stop town where eventually we moved to Indianapolis. And I finished out high school. So that was quite a turn of I think environments, went to Indianapolis, finished high school. And after that, you know, decided, wow, I need a much better way to pay for college and try to figure out the next phase of life. And so that brought me to the Air Force. You know, the Air Force since then lead to a lot of different opportunities. But that's the real skinny of where I'm from, and just kind of you know that upbringing. Michael Hingson ** 03:08 Well, there you go. What was it like? Having a single parent? I mean, I'm, I never did. I had both my parents until, well, I was 34. So I was out on my own and married by them. But what was it like having just a single mother and not a dad around? Absolutely. Kiefer Jone ** 03:29 That's a great question. It's one that you know, I got to reflect on a little bit. And one of you know, and one of these these topics I'm sure we're gonna talk on. But that was one of the early challenges I think I faced and it was something that I'll be honest and kind of say, it's almost that old saying that if you can't miss something that you never had. And so I think that that just as a child, that's the way that it was to me, you know, people ask me that question all the time. And it's, I just, I didn't miss what I didn't have. And so, it I didn't meet I met my biological father, and much later in life when I was 27 years old, my goal, but during, you know, growing up and everything else, it was something that just wasn't because I didn't have it. Yeah. So it was, you know, I was grateful for what I did have, Michael Hingson ** 04:15 what was it like meeting him? Kiefer Jone ** 04:19 It was, you know, that it was curiosity was the was the biggest thing it was, you know, nurture nature, kind of those setting some of those arguments to the side and trying to figure that out. And I will say, you know, I had no expectations. And I showed up and we met each other and he's very different from myself. And you know, his family is very different. And it was it was enlightening. It was it was good, but it really, I would say that at the end of the day, it also didn't. It was nice to get some of those I guess those curiosities checked off the box. Outside of that it was just kind of a another day As we keep in contact lately, you know, I'll shoot him a message every now and again during the holidays or something. But it's not a relationship that that neither of us, I think, you know, have and continue to maintain. Yeah. Michael Hingson ** 05:11 And I'm not surprised at that, you know, my one of my biggest curiosities, the question that I get asked all the time, is, well, you're blind, don't you want to see. And my response to that is, you know, life's an adventure. And having eyesight for me now would be another adventure. But I don't live just to get eyesight. I'm curious, it'd be interesting to experience it to know what it's like. But if it doesn't happen, it's not the end of the world for me. And I believe that all of us are not. Well, we're not, we're not formed, and we're not molded by our eyesight or lack of eyesight. We're molded by all sorts of different characteristics about us. And I would like to think that if I had eyesight from the beginning, I would still be somewhat like I am. And if I got eyesight, even after now, I wouldn't change my attitudes, because I think I've learned a lot about what it's like to see without actually having experienced it. So it's, it's kind of a fascinating thing, but I hear exactly what you're saying. It's, you know, it's a curiosity. And you got to satisfy that which is great as your mom's still around. Kiefer Jone ** 06:31 She is indeed, yeah, she still lives very near the same town where I grew up that so. Michael Hingson ** 06:38 And she keeps you honest. Kiefer Jone ** 06:42 She does indeed. Yeah. keeps me honest. She taught me you know, to be to be good to people. And to be kind. Michael Hingson ** 06:47 Well, you got it from two sides, because you're now married. That's absolutely correct. And your and your wife's name is? 06:54 Her name is Christine. Christine. Okay. Yeah. But she goes Kiefer Jone ** 06:58 my team. Michael Hingson ** 06:59 I was gonna say she goes by teen I thought, this is silent as Chris is silent. And Christine. Yeah. She's my better half. Well, and she keeps yelling at us, which is kind of cool. So you went to high school? Did you go to college? Kiefer Jone ** 07:14 So I went to a year of college, my goal, and that's when I found out that I could not pay for it. And so that's when I said, How are we going to make this happen? You know, how are we going to address this obstacle, this challenge and the Air Force seemed like a really great opportunity, a good place to get that opportunity. Michael Hingson ** 07:33 So you joined the Air Force? And what did you go off and do in the Air Force? Kiefer Jone ** 07:37 Yes, sir. joined the Air Force. And I came in as what they call a client systems technician. And so I started my career in the Air Force working on computers, any end user device with an IP address? That was the work that I got to work on. So Michael Hingson ** 07:52 did you fly yourself or what? Kiefer Jone ** 07:58 That's that one is the common question. Hey, Air Force guy, you fly, right? No. So that's Michael Hingson ** 08:04 why I asked because I kind of got the feeling that you weren't one of the ones that will set behind the stick. No, Kiefer Jone ** 08:10 sir. And I was the guy who helped, you know, fix his computer, fix his email, get into his server, whatever he or she needed. That's when I that's what I helped do. Michael Hingson ** 08:19 My father worked for the government for many years. As a contractor, he ran the precision measurements equipment lab at Edwards Air Force Base, in the well, in the 1960s, in the 1970s. So he worked with all of the test pilots and stuff, he worked with Neil Armstrong, Joe Walker, who flew the x 15, and other things like that. And his job was to make sure that everybody who worked for him, made sure that all the all the equipment and everything worked the way it was supposed to, which was a fascinating job. We went out and visited Edwards a few times. It was really funny. We went out once and my dad came on. So you can't come in quite yet. We've got some top secret equipment, and you can't come into the lab. And I said, Why is that an issue for me? And he said, Well, it is anyway. So Kiefer Jone ** 09:13 that's a good point. And that's, you know, if you don't ask the answers, always no. Yeah. Michael Hingson ** 09:17 Well, I didn't mind but it was it was fun to be able to ask the question and he laughed at it and and then when we got inside, everybody else laughed too. And they said we could election and my dad said, well, the rules are the rules. And I'm not gonna complain. Yeah. Which is, that Kiefer Jone ** 09:35 is a fascinating thing. It doesn't you know, often specify and that it doesn't talk about, you know, people having visual disabilities and those things that just to hear the policy you either have the clearance or you don't, right. Michael Hingson ** 09:48 So, you, you worked on the computers, you kept everybody going and all that. You must have some really interesting stories of challenges or things that you faced when you did that or any any kind of Cute stories to tell, not to give away secrets, but just fun stories. Kiefer Jone ** 10:05 I mean, we did some really incredible work, you know, I would say that the most rewarding part of my entire Air Force career was when, you know, I had the ability and the opportunity to deploy it. And so when I did that, I was able to go out into, you know, the, the Al dhafra, in the United Arab Emirates. And we got to be a really large part of the connective tissue of the Air Force, it was, hey, not only is this the system that you're integrating on to this network, but this is how it's, you know, helping us utilize command and control capabilities to you know, fight enemies and do operations. And that was just such a really, really neat experience. And it helped, you know, be the adhesive glue for my career and say, Wow, okay, I'm not just fixing so and so's email, this, you know, this solution that we put in over here, this was some really incredible work. That Michael Hingson ** 10:53 made up a big difference in did help. Place the glue that held everything together. And that makes perfect sense. And that really shows that no matter what your job is, all jobs are valuable. And we should never look down on or treat anyone differently just because their job isn't what we think is as important as our job because the bottom line is it very well could be Kiefer Jone ** 11:16 you agree more. Yeah, everybody. It's just all about the perspective lens. We're looking at it through. Michael Hingson ** 11:22 So you were in the Air Force for what, seven years? Yes, sir. 11:26 No, I'm Michael Hingson ** 11:28 sorry. Oh, you're you're in Europe for seven years. Europe Kiefer Jone ** 11:31 for seven and a half years now I was in the Air Force for a bow. I think just around nine years, almost at the 10 year marker. Michael Hingson ** 11:41 So what happened at the end of seven years in Europe. So Kiefer Jone ** 11:44 it was a bit of a strange story there. So I went to Europe as an Air National Guardsmen. And that's what I originally was, I was the guy who showed up did my job once a month and I worked for civilian companies regularly. So I worked for Dell and Eli Lilly previously. And then so they brought me to Europe on this interesting tour that said, Hey, this is a state budget, not a federal budget. And for you National Guard, guys, because we know you have commercial experience, we want to utilize you to help the Air Force over here to make it better. And so I've had to work, probably five different jobs. By the time I was I was done in Germany and got out of the uniform. And within that three and a half years, we were in Germany, I met a really great program manager for this exciting company that I hadn't heard of called Agile defense. And at that time, he said, Hey, I would love for you to come and join us join our team. I think it'd be a great asset for our company. And that kicked me off into my role as a government contractor and it brought us for another interesting assignment and Aviano Italy. And so that's where, you know, we we spent the rest of our European adventure and stayed out there for almost seven and a half years total in Europe altogether. Coming back to America, just this June, actually. Michael Hingson ** 13:00 Wow. Yeah. And then you so you left the Air Force, and eventually and then what happened? What did you do then? Kiefer Jone ** 13:09 I said, Yeah, so I left the Air Force and because I got to take off the uniform and pretty much show back up the next day as a contractor it was I just took the uniform off and came back and you know, the khakis and a polo or something and started my job and Aviano Italy. And once I became a government contractor, my role was was similar but different. You know, so I worked. Instead of reporting directly to the folks in the military uniforms, the Air Force members, I got work beside them as their peer as their consultant is their advisor for their technological solutions and to help maintain those and I essentially just, I helped manage a data center at Aviano Italy and, you know, got to help them and integrate well with their operations along the way, picking up interests and becoming passionate and business agility and some of the Agile frameworks. Did Michael Hingson ** 14:03 it feel a lot different since you were no longer reporting directly to the military? And it had to be a little bit different feeling? Kiefer Jone ** 14:13 Oh, yeah, it was and it took me a little bit to find my my ground. You know, just to walk in through the door and say, okay, you know, and it was that amount of freedom I think was a little bit liberating to come in through the door and say, Oh, I'm, I know what I need to do. I know what my job is. I know what my requirements are. And so I just go and I do that rather than waiting for someone to tell me what to do. And especially because this happened at the same time as COVID It was especially interesting because I was the first government contractor to Aviano Italy and so I truly was there kind of on my own just saying, hey, not only my approaching this changing career, but now change in reality and life at the moment with the lock downs and different things happening. And Italy was just so heavily afflicted by the throes of the pandemic. And, you know, probably arguably more than many of the European countries because their, their age demographic was much older. So a lot of unique and interesting challenges in the year of 2019 2020, not just for me, but for everyone. Michael Hingson ** 15:22 Yeah, it had to be unusual for me, when COVID hit. I was in New York, on the fifth of March of 2020, even when I had a speech to give that night, which I did. And then I went back to the hotel, and I was hearing about this guy who attended the synagogue and he had this disease COVID. And it was spreading and all that. And they were talking about locking down the city and I went, I don't like this. So I was scheduled to fly out the next afternoon at like 430 or five o'clock, and I went, I'm not going to do that. They're going to lock down the city, I better escape. So I changed my flight. And I went out at 730 in the morning, and I'm glad I did, I got out before they locked down the city. And oh my gosh, girl with a couple of days later, but it could have been not. And so it was good to just get out. But it was a strange feeling. I came home. And my wife, who was still alive at the time had rheumatoid arthritis. So that's an autoimmune disease situation. So it made it easier to just stay home. And travel was was cut off pretty quickly anyway, but it was easy to stay home, because I didn't want to do anything that would jeopardize her Of course. And so we both just agreed to lock down and stay at home. And we liked each other well enough that we could talk and we just spend lots of time together. And then all went well. And I learned a lot about zoom and learn how to do podcasting. And that was very helpful later on. But the bottom line is, yeah, it was certainly a tough time for all of us. And the only thing that I find very unfortunate is so many people refuse to mask when they went out. And I think that they contributed greatly to the number of people who caught COVID and perished from it. Yeah, yeah. I mean, that was just one of those things. But everybody makes their own choices. Yes, sir. And then you. You go you go deal with that? Well, so then when it so you came back from Italy? This year, this June? Wow. And you're in the summertime. Now, when did you and team get married? Tina Kiefer Jone ** 17:45 and I got married, we will have been married seven years on the 21st of this month. Michael Hingson ** 17:50 And Do either of you speak Italian? Well, Kiefer Jone ** 17:53 we both do X good for you. Yeah, we both learned we learned a German as well. So it took three years of German was there. And it was that was really challenging. But in Italy, it was you know, we knew the drill. We knew what we needed to do. And so it was not only easier, because we spent a lot of time learning the German language. But now it was easier because Italian as a whole is much simpler language. German is very challenging as far as structure and rules. So Michael Hingson ** 18:22 yeah, I love what Mark Twain said about German, which is basically that you start talking and you talk until the verb comes out at the other end. I took three years of German in high school, so I understood that but yeah. So you came back. And what do you do now? Kiefer Jone ** 18:44 Yeah, so now I still work with the same great company, the same company, it's adult defense, and I actually support another Air Force agency called the Air Force Office of Scientific Research. So they're my primary customer and our primary customer at the moment. At the same time, I spend a lot of time you know, supporting my wife's business because we both co own a multimedia company called Tiki design productions. And so I'm usually pretty, pretty busy. Michael Hingson ** 19:13 Cool. Tell me about the company. What do you do? Yeah, Kiefer Jone ** 19:17 so my wife started this back in Germany because she went to Indiana University as a film student, and she graduated and almost right after graduation, we moved to Germany. And because she just couldn't go up to a film agency and say, Hey, can I work here because this isn't the way it works with the SOFA agreement and everything else. We decided to start our own endeavor there. And you know, you put a team plus keeper together, chop off some of the letters and that becomes Tiki. So that was actually coined by my mother. And so we created Tiki design productions. Yeah. And so with that company, you know, we provide what we like to call digital storytelling as a service. And so digital storytelling is a service is essentially, you know, everybody has a story to tell, as you know, you have me on this on this amazing podcast to tell my story. And I loved reading and hearing about yours. And digital storytelling is now because everything is so digitally involved phones, you know computers, tablets, et cetera. Everybody has these incredible stories, whether you're an individual or a business partner, or a mom and pop shop down the street. And so our job is to not only get to hear your story, but then to tell it and in a way that is emotional and captivating and, and cohesive not just another business sticker or placement, it's we truly pride ourselves on being able to tell people's stories in an authentic and unique way. And that's been really rewarding. Michael Hingson ** 20:44 So what, what do you do to really bring a story alive? When you're, when you're doing a digital storytelling? What brings the story to people what, what draws them in to the story? Kiefer Jone ** 21:00 Absolutely. So we spend some time at first, you know, getting to interview those folks, we get to interview the people, or the person that is, you know, that has hired us for our service. And we spend a good amount of time getting their emotions and getting what really, you know, makes them passionate about what they do. And so through that investigative, you know, mindset through inquisitiveness, through all of these things, we can then start to put ideas behind some of these videos, and some of these stories and we work collaboratively with them to say, Hey, this is what we're envisioning, right. And my wife has such a wonderful eye and wonderful gift to talk to people. And even if it's something is, you know, she did this recently for something like real estate, it sounds on paper, it's not the sexiest shiniest thing, right? It doesn't sound that incredible. And somehow she's able to ask enough questions in the right questions to grab this story, shape it into, you know, anywhere between a three minute long commercial or a seven minute long commercial or something like that. And just the way, you know, filming is done, the way that she films, the color grading all of these professional qualities that she puts behind it, she turns it into an unbelievable product. And people often you know, when they're done, they can't believe that she was able to tell their story in such a significant light. It's something that, you know, she's, they're really proud of which in turn, it makes us really proud. Michael Hingson ** 22:23 So many people just don't understand that everyone really does have a story to tell I've had so many people say, Well, if I come on your podcast, I don't know what I talked about. Because my story is not interesting. It's not like these other people who have these interesting and amazing careers. And it is so difficult to get people to understand that everyone has a story. And the stories are there. It is a matter of helping to draw them out. But but they're there. So what do people when they why do they engage Tiki to do that? What is what is the whole idea behind digital storytelling? Kiefer Jone ** 23:06 I you know, I think we touched on it just a little bit. But it is it's it's that you have a desire to tell your story. At the end of the day, we all want to have our story told and we you know, we'd like it to live somewhere. And previously, it was books and a lot of people putting their stories and memoirs into books. But with digital media being the new norm and consumption being done through the internet, it just seems like this is the the natural next step is what is our digital story. What's the our footprint and our legacy look like in the digital realm. And so people, people come to us for that. Michael Hingson ** 23:41 So how do people use the stories that you create? Kiefer Jone ** 23:46 Or they'll use them mostly everything from you know, people just wanting to tell a story about their first date of how they met their loved ones. And they'll post it on Facebook to share with people that they know and love. And you'll see others, you know, utilizing business commercials and they'll promote that either on whether it's you know, Facebook, Instagram, social media, any of those form factors, but as well as internet ads on YouTube or television, so I can go as small or as deep as anybody likes. Wow. Michael Hingson ** 24:16 What's the longest story that you've created? I Kiefer Jone ** 24:21 think that a lot of those you know, as far as length is concerned, it it normally that one is almost always like wedding videos. So a lot of people you know they love those those stories and I think that with those you spend a whole day capturing footage and being able to tell that kind of story and it's a special one to tell it is usually people you know, that one's a lot, a lot more for the memories. I think of those folks rather than it is for everyone else to sit and watch it because even businesses you know, don't typically want a a 20 minute long commercial or want their story to be told for that long. So I'd have to say I think weddings Michael Hingson ** 24:59 that your 20 minute story is a is a long story, especially for for business people who operate in the mindset that anything beyond a 30 or a 62nd video, people will lose attention. And I'm not exact, totally sure about that. But that's, but I understand 20 minutes is way too long to, it's all in how you tell the story as to how long you can make it and keep people's interest? Yeah. Kiefer Jone ** 25:29 It goes back to that that y value of okay, well, who's it for? Who are we making it for? And what's the what, what do you want to get out of this? And with wedding videos, I think it's just, it's, it's become a better version of a scrapbook? Michael Hingson ** 25:41 Very much so. And that and that makes sense. Well, so you do that. So do you do company work? Well, how much of your time do you spend doing it? 25:55 Just depends, you Kiefer Jone ** 25:56 know, everything in art seems to be feast and famine, you get a little bit in a you know, sometimes you're you've got a lot of different clientele and different things to do. And sometimes it's not so much. So I get to ebb and flow my time pretty well. But there's, you know, at least there's always something to be done. If it's not directly helping the service or to help my wife was something we go into. Okay, well, what's our next what's our next marketing strategy looks like from Mr. Company. Okay, how do we promote ourselves? Where do we? Where do we go? And what do we who do we target to be able to continue? Michael Hingson ** 26:28 And did you say you still do the government contract work? Kiefer Jone ** 26:31 Yes, sir. Five days a week, Michael Hingson ** 26:33 you you keep pretty busy. Yes, sir. And if they wanted you to come and do a digital story about the company yet? Oh, well, because Kiefer Jone ** 26:42 this is, you know, the Air Force Office of Scientific research has its own PR department that you know, that they don't really ask me to do any of that. Michael Hingson ** 26:52 Well, you never know. Something. That's something to think about. Well, so you and your wife clearly have a very good and close relationship. But I think that's important. We got to do that for 40 years. So I understand the whole concept. But you, you have this relationship, what are kind of maybe the three or so things that you really feel, go into making up your relationship and keeping everything so positive? Yeah, Kiefer Jone ** 27:25 yes, sir. And Michael, I was, I was so sad to hear about your late wife. I'm very sorry. Michael Hingson ** 27:31 Well, like I tell people, though, I need to continue to be a good kid. Because if I don't, I'm going to hear about it from her. She's up there monitoring somewhere. Kiefer Jone ** 27:41 Yes, there. Yeah, you know, our relationship is an interesting one. Because my wife and I spent so much of our initial time, just getting to know each other, there was, you know, we we actually weren't together. And we, we both met each other very independent stages of our lives. And it was something that it was almost tangible, I could feel that independence about her. And she could feel it about myself. And so we actually, you know, we were just friends, and we just got to know each other. And so, I do think that the bulk of our relationship, and I would say any real great relationship has to be built on the foundation of honesty, and I'm talking real honesty, you know, showing who the real you is. And that requires a bit of bravery to be the real you and to talk about and say, hey, no subject is too taboo. We're going to talk about everything. And so I think that that's the, the first pillar. And the other two from that, I think are you know, they are products that rely heavily on honesty, right, so if your relationship is built, if your foundation is built on honesty, one of the things that comes as more of a result of that the second most important thing to me is laughter. Right, finding time to be silly. And, you know, with being honest, and your true self, there's a bit of silliness that comes with that naturally, you know, and so lots and lots of laughter I don't think that you can ever go wrong and you know, being a big kid and laughing all the time. And you know, the third most important thing to me is communication. And again, that is a another product of honesty, discussing everything and often you know, it's I find it hard to hear when people you know, have to schedule time for each other to sit down and just have a conversation and I can you know, I can try to understand because I know that people get busy but you know, we just communication is such a giant pillar in our relationship that I couldn't imagine having to schedule time to sit down with my wife to get a few words and Michael Hingson ** 29:50 yeah, I appreciate all three of those because they're they're very much a part of what made our marriage I think such a great One communication is so important. And you have to do it all the time. And we liked talking to each other about anything. And as you pointed out honesty and being open is absolutely crucial about whatever. And it's important to be able to have that deep of a relationship, that you can talk about anything and not judge. And I think that's the other part of it. You, you communicate, but you don't judge the other person just because they are honest enough to tell you something that, you know, you didn't even think about. 30:37 Exactly, yes, sir. Michael Hingson ** 30:41 We had a podcast interview quite a while ago with a gentleman who lives back near where you live. And when he and his wife turned 40, he asked her, he said, So what do you want to do with the rest of your life? And she said, I want to adopt a daughter from China, which totally floored him. And he said, why? And she told him, Well, they eventually did it, it became an adventure for them. And I think the daughter Mia is probably about 2425 years old. And a few years ago, she wanted to actually try to find her birth parents, which is hard in China, but they did. And he's written a book about it, which is really cool. 31:24 What's the name of the book? Michael Hingson ** 31:26 I wish I could remember, but it is. If you still have the email, I said, I'll have to go find the episode. But it's, if you still have the email that I sent you as one of the episodes that that I included. Kiefer Jone ** 31:40 Okay, I do. Excellent. Yeah, I'll have to make sure to go and watch that one and get the book sounds, you know, some similarities there. Just meeting parents and that kind of challenge. How fascinating. Michael Hingson ** 31:52 Yeah, he's, it's a fascinating story. But he really worked hard at going through it all. And they, they agreed, and they went and they adopted a daughter. And then they adopted a second daughter. And I wish I could remember the name of the book right off, but it's been a long time. It's like episode 38 or something. And we're up at episode 277. So it's a while ago, but it's a fascinating book. I haven't read the book. It wasn't available in a form I could read, but he told me all about it. So it was really fascinating to hear the story. Well, that happens. So you have gone through some physical challenges in your existence, haven't you? Kiefer Jone ** 32:40 Yes, sir. It's yeah, it was, you know, towards the tail end of us leaving leaving Europe. And yeah, I had a separate a really serious Polly traumatic incident in Innsbruck, Austria. Ah, Michael Hingson ** 32:58 and what happened, if you want to talk about it? Yeah, Kiefer Jone ** 33:01 of course, I was. I was snowboarding we were in school. It was a ski resort that my wife and I loved and we cherish and we've been to it so many times. And it was a wonderful day, like so many of our days spent out there and the snow was coming down. And we were just having a great time. And essentially, on this run, that there's a, there's a little fork in the road, and either you stay in the Austrian side, or the other side allows you to go over to Switzerland, which is really neat. You know, isn't that something being able to snowboard in two different places. And so, I'm just really going and we're moving because it's feeling good. And we're probably, you know, probably 45 miles an hour, I think my my friend who was with us had his GoPro and he caught the whole thing on video for both good and bad. But as we're coming down this and I'm getting to that fork in the road, somebody yells at me, and I realized that I might be missing my turn. So I turn around to look because I look ahead and I see this signs there, then the steel signage jetting out, I see. Okay, it's probably 15 feet ahead and I turn around the look. And then as soon as I turn my my head back forward, that's the basically the steel signs that were pointing out of the postage, it hit me right underneath my right eye, and it immediately caved my skaaland and shattered it into about 14 pieces, some of those pieces getting lodged into the the front part of my brain. And so you know, immediately it knocked me unconscious and my then lifeless body, I guess. And unflinching body goes into the poll, which was not covered. And so all of my ribs on my right side were broken and a number of them went through my lungs. My rotator cuff and my right shoulder was shattered and I broke, you know, or I fractured my spine as well. And so you know, I was I was at the highest Glasgow Coma. index level that you can be. And, again, due to my wife and her quick ability to act, she came down and she saw me and knew that something wasn't right. And just, you know, this just shows just her brain and how incredible it is she was able to not only call the right number, which isn't 911, you know, it's 112 Over there. Yeah, call the number. And she got somebody on the line. And she was able to, you know, despite language challenges and barriers there, she was able to get some folks over to pick me up via helicopter. Michael Hingson ** 35:36 And so when you do it, you do it right, don't you? Kiefer Jone ** 35:38 Oh, yeah, I guess so. 35:42 Anyway, go ahead. Oh, no. So the helicopter, Kiefer Jone ** 35:44 it came and picked me up and they had to resuscitate me in the back of this helicopter, you know, a few. Who knows how long the doctors weren't sure. They, you know, but either a minute, the other way, and I wouldn't be having this conversation. You know, I heard this so many times during my recovery from my doctors. And so that sent me into a coma. And I was in a coma for seven days in Innsbruck, Austria and their ICU unit for their hospital over there. And when I finally did wake up, I was blind in my right eye, and not because of the damage to my eye, my eyes actually completely healthy. You wouldn't you know, if you could see me, Michael, you wouldn't believe it, but the eye is completely healthy. And it's just this specific damage done to my brain. This left me now permanently blind. Michael Hingson ** 36:38 In your right eye? 36:39 Yes, sir. Michael Hingson ** 36:40 Do you see still well, from your left eye? Kiefer Jone ** 36:43 Yeah, left. I mean, I didn't see super well, before I added contacts and glasses my whole life. So but you Michael Hingson ** 36:50 can you drive? I can drive you okay. Kiefer Jone ** 36:53 You know, that was one of the, you know, part of the recovery process. The Michael Hingson ** 36:57 brain is such an adaptable thing, and made great that you can do that. Well, so what, what got you through all of that? Kiefer Jone ** 37:09 This was this is one of those one of those things, you know, we talked about positive adaptability a little bit. And, you know, I think when I think about positive adaptability, I think about it in three different ways is how I've been able to sum it up, you know, the, I think it's centered around three parts and positive adaptability. Part one is gratitude, you know, gratitude, how can I reflect? What can I be thankful for. And as I was in that hospital, and I woke up, obviously, the first thing I'm thankful for is Oh, my God, I'm alive. You know, the next section of gratitude was, okay, I think I have, you know, I know who I am. I have my memories, even though these doctors are saying you might not have this, you might not have that they're unsure. But that's what that's all that's going through my through my brain at the time is, how can I what am I, you know, I'm grateful about all of these different things. And then the next part of positive adaptability is really intention. So I have gratitude for for everything that I still have all of this stuff, but now what's, what's my intention? And I knew that my intention in that bed before I could even really before I had walked, before I had really moved at all before I, you know, knew whether or not I could, it was that I was gonna get better. That was my intention, whatever that looks like, even if it was accepting this new normal. Right. And so it was, you know, this is, this was a big intention. That's a big blanket intention. I guess, you know, for my other Agile methodology, industry, people, we could call that the epic to the user stories, my intention was to get better. And then after that, it was it was action. So you know, first reflecting and saying, Hey, I'm grateful. Second was, what do what do I want to do? And then third was action, first step, and all that I could do really Michael was to listen to the doctors, listen to people listen to my wife, who was visiting. And then it was basic things after that was okay. How do I eat? How do I get? How do I get nutrients back into my body? How do I if I can't walk, can I practice sitting up in the hospital bed? And so I would, you know, kind of sit up and do what I could and move different parts of my body. And then it was, Okay, the next iterative thing, how do I walk at first, I couldn't even walk a few steps to the bathroom. And then it was just iterative progress of, okay, you made it to this title last time key for it. Can you make it a little bit further? Can you make it a little bit further? And then it was memory tests, you know, all the way up to just this summer? I did my first 5k that I've done, you know, since my accident, and so I did a 5k this summer. How long ago was the accident? The accident was in February, I'm sorry, January of 20 2214. Michael Hingson ** 40:04 Wow. Okay, so you'll be coming up on two years soon. Yes, sir. But you did the 5k. 40:13 Yeah. Yeah. Well, how Michael Hingson ** 40:15 did you learn about this concept of positive adaptability? Kiefer Jone ** 40:21 It's, it's something that I had, you know, I'd never heard it until I think I, I started doing a lot of introspection introspection during my recovery, there was, there was a three month part of my recovery where I didn't really get up, and I didn't really do anything, my doctor said that, hey, you just need to be still be there, do some cognitive, you know, there are great applications out there, I used a couple of them to train my brain and help develop my my new synapses. Because micros, I'm sure, you know, when your brain gets damaged, your brain never heals, it just creates new roads to travel down, right. And so, you know, utilizing that I spent a lot of time in my own mind, just thinking. And positive adaptability was something that, you know, I don't know if I coined it, but it's certainly going to be the name of the book that I hope to put out in 2025, because nobody's taken the title yet. So it's something that I just, I, I found that that was the way that I approached my life. And it was even that way before my accident, it was this is, you know, this is how I've gotten from here to here it almost every challenge and major obstacle of my life. It's not, you know, it's not just resiliency or optimism. It's it's positive adaptability. And when I said it, I wrote it down in my, in my phone, and I started writing ideas for books, and I started, you know, more fleshing out this concept that I hadn't really been introduced to, but that I think, just makes a lot of sense in the way a lot of people navigate their challenges and obstacles and you yourself, I believe, are a, a wonderfully shining candidate of positive adaptability. Well, Michael Hingson ** 42:06 I think that all too often we, we focus on so many negative things, we focus on why we can't do stuff, as opposed to how we make it happen. And there's no reason that we can't do whatever we feel we can do. And I mean that and and again, not to be in a punish a punny way, but in a positive way, we really can be positive, we really can learn to adapt and do so many things that we don't think we can. And, and unfortunately, I think all too often we get taught that we can't do things, we can't really be as malleable and as adaptable as we really can be. Right? And it gets to be a real a real challenge. So you, you just suddenly created this concept. If I were you, I'd go copyright it somewhere. And that way, you've got it for the book. Yeah, yeah, that's Kiefer Jone ** 43:07 good feedback. And, you know, it's something that I have to look into. But yeah, positive adaptability is truly, you know, ever since I started, it's something that I, I bring up often, and I've tried to, you know, the folks that I get to interact with, and the way I get to work with people try to implement these things in every which way, not only in personal life, but professionally, too. Michael Hingson ** 43:28 So just sort of out of curiosity, what would you say is the difference between positive adaptability and resilience? Because resilience is, of course, something that many of us experience were resilient, because we, we overcome adversity and so on. But what's the difference between positive adaptability and resilience? Absolutely. Kiefer Jone ** 43:48 And that was something you know, I had sat and dwell on for a while. And you know, we, when we think about resilience, we think about typically elasticity, we think about the ability of someone to snap or bounce back from something, maybe it's from adversity, maybe it's just a large challenge, about resiliency, in my opinion, it doesn't really imply that, you know, a positive choice was really made, or maybe a bad pattern. And so, you know, the simplest example I can think of is, you know, somebody walks through the door, and maybe they get punched in the face, right? And they get sick, I'm going to be resilient about this. I'm going to do the same thing tomorrow and do it again and again, and you can take a lot of punches, right, but doesn't necessarily mean we solved a problem. But we can take that and expand that. As far as you know, someone might say, Well, my country has showed true resilience regarding this war. And maybe they had but maybe no one had ever questioned if if was that war being fought for the right reasons. You know, were we incredibly resilient, but did we was it for the right purpose? And so, for me resiliency defined And someone's ability or you know, an entity's ability to bounce back. But positive adaptability can provide us with really positive posturing for how we land advantageous lead. Michael Hingson ** 45:14 Okay, go into that a little bit more, if you would. Kiefer Jone ** 45:18 Sure. Yeah. I mean, I think that just talking about essentially positive adaptability is the heading. It is, you know, it's not only saying, Hey, I'm choosing to look at this positively and be resilient about it. But this is a heading for where I need to go. This is the direction for where I want to take this. And I think that that stems back into kind of what what positive adaptability means to me. And it's just so much more than just optimism. Yeah. Michael Hingson ** 45:50 Well, it clearly is, because it's not enough to be optimistic, but it's taking that and deciding on a direction deciding on a choice. And then following through with that, until either you find that you made a great choice. Or you find that, well, maybe that wasn't such a good choice. And what we need to do is alter course a little bit, which gets back to the adaptability part of it. Kiefer Jone ** 46:22 Exactly. And that's, and that's, you know, when I when I think about it, and how I would describe it to others. And you know, just now that we're talking about that, and kind of centered around optimism, as you know, so if, for example, we take these three pillars of positive adaptability, gratitude, intention, and action, and we think about it from the point of optimism, gratitude, and looking at the old optimistic phrase of the glass is half full. Right. So when I think about gratitude, first we say, well, I'm grateful for water. Okay, excellent. We are grateful for water. But then when we think about intention, okay, well, why are we grateful for this water? What is our intention? Is it to have more water? So then my question might be, how do we find a stream? Is the question is my intention to make it look like we have more water than maybe my intention, then is to find a smaller cup, right? Or is my intention to share the water? So then how can I get multiple cups so that we're all sharing this, and then action is carrying out that action? So it's, it's optimism, it's resilience plus? Michael Hingson ** 47:36 Makes perfect sense. And the the whole idea, again, is to really learn more about yourself. And I talk a lot about introspection, spending time at the end of the day, what worked, what didn't work. And even when and something worked, can I make it better, but really looking at yourself in a in a positive light, and recognizing that there really isn't such a thing as failure? It's another opportunity. And the failure is, well, this didn't work the way I expected it to work. That's not mean it was a failure. That doesn't mean I should be defeated. It means All right, what's next sports fans? And how do we move forward from here? Hmm, sir. And I think that that's what what most people really miss in the whole process is taking the time to analyze and look at yourself and you, you're your best teacher, nobody else can teach you like you can teach you. And so we should look at what goes on around us and what we do. And look at it in the light of how can I make it better? Kiefer Jone ** 48:49 Yeah, yeah. And I think that, you know, it comes down to just folks in their, their practical strategies and sort of exercises that I guess they can develop to sustain that kind of, of, you know, mindset. 49:04 Yeah. Michael Hingson ** 49:07 So have you read any books or encountered other kinds of things that have really helped you move forward on this whole concept of positive adaptability? Ah, Kiefer Jone ** 49:18 yeah, you know, that the first one that comes to mind, of course, is my wife, my better half, right? So just being so instrumental in our transparent communication, and a partner and a resource and a grounding point for everything that I do. Sometimes I might just come out and blurt out the most ridiculous idea she's ever heard. But she'll say, well keep her that was, you know, that was here, but you know, how do we make it here? Or she might tell and keep it that's crazy. So, you know, she is the wives can do that. And that's fair. They keep us grounded. And so yeah, I couldn't have I couldn't have imagined a better partnership and I love having her in my life to be that person. And I To say that, you know, the, on top of someone to share experiences with and to mentor and do these things I have had a significant, you know, nudge in my life from an executive at our company, agile defense, and his name is Lonnie Nichols. And he's, you know, despite all of his busyness as an executive to our company, and being a great family, man, he's been, you know, a great guide, he's nudged me to be better. He's he actually challenged me to get on this with you today, Michael, because at first I said, the same thing I think a lot of your folks do is, I don't have a story to tell. He said, Keep Ramona, I think it's even more important that you do this, right. And so he, he challenged me to do this. And he's been, you know, challenging me to just be better in every way that I can. And he also eats, breathes and sleeps, you know, this mantra of listen first. And I love that, and I've applied that in my life. And he's, you know, he's turned me on to a number of books that I've read. And, you know, outside of that some resources that I've I've implemented that, you know, helped me more with positive adaptability, I have this great gift, my wife bought me called The Five Minute Journal. And you know, every single page, it essentially has an incredible quote at the top, it's small, it's short, it asks you to list three things you're grateful for. And three things that would make today great, a daily affirmation, you know, then you get, at the end of the day, at night, when you do your retrospective, you look through and you list three highlights of your day. And then what you learned. And so that's been an incredibly wonderful, you know, thing to have in my life and implement. And it always allows me, as you said, Michael, to go back and reflect and see if I could have made something a little bit better. And I love that. Michael Hingson ** 51:43 And even if you can't, you may tomorrow. Exactly, Kiefer Jone ** 51:47 yeah, you write about it the next day. But you know, outside of that I got, you know, Ted lasso. For it being a fictional television show, I couldn't imagine a more positively adaptable character out there that I've I still, every time I watch the show, it's only three seasons long, I continue to learn something new that I can apply to my life to others, the lives of others. And that's been a really great show. And then there's a book out there called Positive Intelligence. That's a book that helps us identify, you know, our sabotage our saboteur thoughts, and our saboteur emotions, and how to live our lives and mitigate some of those things. Well, Michael Hingson ** 52:28 one thing that I think is coming out of this is I would love to have your friend from national defense to come on the podcast as well, how do we get him on? Kiefer Jone ** 52:35 Oh, man, I think he, I think he'd be happy to do it. And he's got, you know, he's got an incredible story as well. And he shared, he shared some of that with me. So I'll definitely, you know, reach out to him and see if I can, you know, hey, you challenge me and challenge you, and Michael Hingson ** 52:50 give you my email address. And let's touch base, I would love to we're always looking for more guests on unstoppable mindset. And, you know, as I said, everyone has a story to tell them, It's neat when people really understand that they have a story to tell and want to tell the story. And, you know, I'm thinking, and I know, I'm doing this during the podcast, but you might think about doing a digital story about positive adaptability, and copyright it and that also starts to get the message out, maybe you do a few of those, and that becomes part of the book. Yeah, yeah, Kiefer Jone ** 53:23 exactly. And that's, you know, that's this is really, Michael, this is kind of phase one for for future implementations and things like that. And it's, it's establishing that as your personal brand, you know, I'm sure that you'd be a great resource and have a lot of advice for, hey, this is this is how you you do this is how you bring your message forward, because you've got such a great one that you're sharing with the world, love Michael Hingson ** 53:45 to help in any way that we can. So can you suggest some exercises and some different things that people can do to kind of help create for themselves this whole idea of a positive adaptability mindset? Ah, Kiefer Jone ** 54:01 yeah, yeah, absolutely. I, you know, we touched on some of this a little bit earlier. And I think that some of the stuff that you said is, it's amazing how, you know, somebody who's been through it, and who has it, you get it already. And you've already said some of the things but there are four things that I think about, you know, and it's, the first one is practicing honesty. And as we talked about earlier, and you'd said, Michael, that the hardest part of honesty is with ourselves. It's that introspection, you know, and it's, I know that that can be challenging for a lot of people. And the first thing I've had folks throw at me is how can I be honest, you know, with about this or about this, and it's, if you need some help, there are resources out there to get it but we do we have to practice honesty in the first time that we do. It's got to be with ourselves. And as you said, you know, ourselves are our best teacher. So number one, practice honesty. Number two, listen, to understand, not respond, listening to understand and that's so challenging and such a big deal in every aspect of life. The third I would say is, as we've talked about a little bit is, reflect and be grateful, you know that you know what best, you know, there's an expression out there, this, you know, you know what the best day of the year is? The best day of the year is today. Yeah, and that's true every single day, you know, we can either make today our masterpiece or our calamity, and everything is a result of the choices that we get to make. So reflecting and be grateful is the third. And finally, the fourth one, that's, you know, I think we miss a lot is that we need to think more about we, and less about me. Yeah, and I like to call this the main character syndrome, society and, and different things, you know, we think that we're the only the only person in the story a lot of folks and you know, even or if it's just, you know, me and my wife, it's my family. It's my, my, my versus our, our, our we, we we and when I think about some great stories out there any great story, right? The first one that comes to my mind is I love the fiction so much, but Harry Potter right? name implies that it's a main character, right? Harry Potter is the main character. But when we think about that, you know, without her without, or I'm sorry, in Harry Potter, without Dumbledore without the you know, friendship of Ron and Hermione Heck, even without his opposition of Voldemort, right? There are so many characters in the story. And that turns out when we really think about it, Harry Potter was not a main character at all. He's, you know, he's a character among so many. And we were just lucky enough to learn about just one of them. Right? Imagine hearing all of the stories about the rest of those people in those books. Well, Michael Hingson ** 56:43 um, all of the books are Harry Potter. And, and I think that's really important because we are telling it from his standpoint. So he's, he's, in a sense, a main character from the standpoint of we're we're hearing his story, but it really is about everyone. It's an incredible world. Now, there's a new series, by the way, the James Potter series, and there are at least five books in that series. So it's about Harry son, at Hogwarts. And there's some really great twists in those. So if you haven't read those, those are, those are another series to look at. 57:21 Oh, I had no idea. Well, I don't want Michael Hingson ** 57:24 to give anything away. Except, you know, let's just say McGonigal doesn't want to and isn't going to be the school mistress at Hogwarts forever. But you'll never guess who becomes the new schoolmaster at the end of the first book, or the beginning of the second book, and I'm not going to give it away. I will never guess it. It is nobody that you can think of I will tell you that right now. All Kiefer Jone ** 57:55 right, I want to put I want to think about and I'll send you an email, you know, for our guests. 58:01 Thanks, thank you. But Michael Hingson ** 58:04 it's a good series. But but the point really is, is that this world is composed of all of us. And we're all part of the same world under the same God. And we've got to start recognizing that it isn't just us ourselves. I always believe in doing things as a team, when I wrote thunder dog, my story of the World Trade Center and working with a guide dog, I had the great honor to work with someone else. And it was a team effort. We both worked, we both wrote, We collaborated, we both edited. And then when I did running with Roselle, which was really for kids, although more adults by it than children, because it's not a picture book. But again, we I collaborated and we're just getting ready to do a new book that the book has written, it's now in the hands of the publisher. And the publisher has actually already put out a pre order link to I guess, gauge interest. But that book is entitled live like a guide dog, stories of a blind man, his dog and his dogs about adversity. Moving forward in faith, and well, I keep blanking out on the whole sub, the whole sub title of the book, but it's adversity, overcoming challenges and moving forward in the faith. And it's it's fun. And it's about learning to control fear, learning that in reality, we all can control the things that happened to us, at least how we react to it. We don't need to be blinded by fear. And so the book is really about that because I talked for 22 years as a speaker about not being afraid going out to the World Trade Center on September 11. But when I Haven't done is taught other people that you can do the same thing. And so it's a lot of fun to do. 1:00:05 Oh, powerful, but Michael Hingson ** 1:00:09 it is about us not Lee. And the writing is better because it's us. And everything we do is better because it's us. There's no I in team and there's a reason for that. Sorry, Kiefer Jone ** 1:00:22 I couldn't agree more. Yeah, we, you know, it takes a village, we none of us get anywhere we are by ourselves. Michael Hingson ** 1:00:28 Right? So for you, besides writing the book, what's next in the world to do? Kiefer Jone ** 1:00:35 Next in the world, and I think this is one of those catalysts for me, Mike? Well, this is one of those things that challenged me to say, hey, and I had to start thinking about it, you know, what do I have the ability? What do I have the ability to do right now? Where can I make an impact? And right now the answer, you know, for me, it's the Internet work, and home, right? Home is the easy one. So I listen, I reflect you know, I, if you're kind to everyone, no harm is going to come from that, you know, live your personal life that way. And that's what I'm going to do to make an impact there. The Internet, this one, you know, opportunities like this, Michael, getting on here with with a great person like yourself, and being able to express and tell someone my story, and growing my personal brand. And this is something that my wife, you know, I happen to be married to someone who specializes in this field. So I'm sure that she's going to help me put my personal brand together and grow the audience through the creation of content and media channels and things like that. And then, utilizing people centric principles around business agility, this is how you know I can, I can spread this stuff throughout work, you know, the business agility, and everything, at its core is all people centric. And again, it's all shaped around how are we bettering communication, psychological safety, trust, a lot of these things we're talking about already that I'm so passionate about. There are now frameworks that I can I can use that are educational frameworks and say, Hey, this works. This is how I can make people's lives that their jobs better and make teams better, which is really pretty wonderful. And so I can utilize that. And the case studies that I've written to share my knowledge and my thoughts at conferences with other agile practitioners. And you know, I'm doing a little bit of that this week, just being online with a bunch of other peers for the Advanced Certified Scrum Master, and continuing my education in that regard. And then, as you had said, by 2025, I, I hope, and I plan to publish a book by the name of positive adaptability. And so that's, that's, you know, if it isn't taken yet, I gotta get out there and copyright it, as you said, Cool. Michael Hingson ** 1:02:45 It is clearly really exciting to see all the things that you're looking to do. And I'm really excited to buy it. And I'm excited about what you're looking to do. And I think, you know, there's a lot that you'll accomplish as you continue to move forward. And I'm looking forward to hearing more about what you do. So you got to keep us posted. If people want to reach out to you and make contact, maybe have their digital story told and so on. How do they do that? Kiefer Jone ** 1:03:18 Absolutely. So our email address is high at Tiki design production, or I'm sorry, it's Hello at Tiki design. productions.com Kiefer Jone ** 1:03:26 and Tiki is T i k i. Yes, sir. So hello 1:03:26 at Tiki design productions.com. And that's yeah, we're you know, we'd love to bring people on and tell your digital story. Cool, you can find us also, you know, on all of the social media stuff, either under Tiki design, which is our company, or Tiki tube, which is you know, the the viral social media accounts that my wife manages, and you know, she's gotten a lot of following there. Michael Hingson ** 1:03:57 Well, I, I hope great success comes your way with all of it and that you get a lot of visibility. I hope people liked what they heard today. And we'll reach out. And I want to thank you for being here. And I want to thank you for listening. All of you are really so well appreciated. We value your input and in your, your comments on the podcast, please keep them coming. And, and reach out to Kiefer and touch base with him. Again, I'd love to hear from you. You're welcome to email me at Michaelhi M i c h a e l h i at accessibe A C C E S S I B E.com. Or go to our podcast page www dot Michael Hingson m i c h a el h i n g s o n.com/podcast. And wherever you're listening, please give us a five star rating. We appreciate that and value it greatly. And we value your comments when you do those ratings as well. So please do that. So we we really love getting the chance to talk to so many people I'd really love having had the chance to talk today Keifer with you. And I want to just thank you one more time for being here with us and giving us so many great insights and ideas. Thank **Kiefer Jone ** 1:05:10 you so much, Mike. I'm grateful for you and your time today. Thank you. I couldn't couldn't be happier. This is the first nudge of many under the future. So thank you. 1:05:23 You have been listening to the Unstoppable Mindset podcast. Thanks for dropping by. I hope that you'll join us again next week, and in future weeks for upcoming episodes. To subscribe to our podcast and to learn about upcoming episodes, please visit www dot Michael hingson.com slash podcast. Michael Hingson is spelled m i c h a e l h i n g s o n. While you're on the site., please use the form there to recommend people who we ought to interview in upcoming editions of the show. And also, we ask you and urge you to invite your friends to join us in the future. If you know of any one or any organization needing a speaker for an event, please email me at speaker at Michael hingson.com. I appreciate it very much. To learn more about the concept of blinded by fear, please visit www dot Michael hingson.com forward slash blinded by fear and while you're there, feel free to pick up a copy of my free eBook entitled blinded by fear. The unstoppable mindset podcast is provided by access cast an initiative of accessiBe and is sponsored by accessiBe. Please visit www.accessibe.com . AccessiBe is spelled a c c e s s i b e. 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