Relaunching Through Fearless Change

You can have a challenging day. You can have something really challenging happen in your life. There's, as you know, there's all kinds,

we call relaunches,

the relaunches, you know, every Tuesday. But this idea of knowing that you're playing for something more, you don't know what that's going to look like. But I firmly believe in a better way.

Welcome to the ReLaunch podcast. This is going to be so good. You know how I know? Because when I first met this woman, it was immediate, just friendship sparks. It's like, oh my gosh. We can talk about this. We can talk about that. There is so much to go into here, but I am going to focus, for all of you listening on something that is so significant in so many of our lives right now, as we relaunch and as we think about newness, as we think about change, as we think about relaunches. And so today, again, the relaunch podcast is where we uncover stories of reinvention and sometimes those bold career moves. And today, we are going to be joined by Linda Boff. She is a trailblazer in marketing, who's navigated truly uncharted territories throughout her career, from shaping creative digital marketing at GE to stepping into her newest role as CEO in a brand new industry. So I mean, how many of us want to make a change, but we don't know how Linda's journey is all about embracing a challenger mindset and finding growth in the unexpected. In this episode, she is going to share how taking those risks and tackling the unknown have actually helped define her path and how they can actually inspire yours. Linda, it is so amazing to finally have this scheduled. We are here, so excited for this

conversation. Hillary, it is my pleasure and honor to be here. I've been looking forward to this. I'm a big fan of of what you do, and just the the whole idea of relaunching. So thrilled to be here, excited for the conversation. Well,

so thrilled about the relaunching concept, because you are the queen of it, girl, this is, like, you've done it. I mean, we're going to talk today. I mean, GE, can we just talk about, you know, that time in your life? How long were you there? Let's talk about the significant relaunch of what happened and what shaped you when you were in this powerhouse position. Yeah,

well, thank you. Um, so GE has always held and will always hold a huge part of my heart. I was there 20 years the last 10 as CMO. I had the honor of working for three storied CEOs in that time, and watching a portfolio and being a part of a portfolio transformation all the way through to last April, when the company split into three separate publicly traded companies. So talk about relaunching. That was the ultimate relaunch. But you know, to work at a company like that that has such a essential role in the world, the world of healthcare, the world of energy, the world of transportation through flight is it's kind of a pinch me brand, and it's, it's doubly so, because it's not a brand that you think about all that often when things are going well. You don't think about the fact that the room that you're in on a cold day is is warm and being heated. You don't think about, necessarily, that, you know, the machinery being used during a mammogram. So the work is so important, but sometimes it's invisibly So, which made it a kind of a constant treasure hunt in finding and telling those stories, which I love doing. And, you know, I spent a long time there, very proud of the team, very proud of the work that we did. And then five months ago, I

that one. I'm not ready for the next relaunch. I

gotta get through this for the moment. We gotta step back here. You just said

three different CEOs that you've worked for, and they're all iconic CEOs, General Electric. I mean, it's one of the, you know, biggest names out there. And you started as a young woman in this field. Can you share with us what brought you to GE and also some of the challenges? You faced along the way being a woman?

Yeah, so I'll take a little bit of a step back if I could in that I have I wasn't. I had already done several things before I had gotten to GE I was passionate in college about radio. I went to ABC radio networks as my first job. I worked in magazine publishing, I worked in a big museum, I worked in a financial institution. And I would say the thing that has propelled me, because I think it's important in this conversation, is I am very curious, and I'm always Hillary, looking for a challenge that doesn't resemble something I've done before. I love the I love the figuring out the puzzle. And so when the opportunity came 20 years ago to go to GE I had never worked in industry before. I had, at the time, been in external marketing. The job that I took at GE was different than any job I had done. It was still within the communication sector, but the job was to do employee marketing. And I remember during the interview saying to the person I would go to work for. Well, this sounds so interesting, but I haven't done this before, so let me introduce you to a friend of mine who I think would be perfect for this and and the person at the time said to me, no, no, I want you in this job because you haven't done it before, because you'll bring a fresh perspective. And I'm such a believer in fresh eyes, in different perspectives, in taking what you the experiences that you've had, and bringing them forward and and being able to apply but kind of shape shift a little bit. So I brought what I had to GE, which didn't resemble what the fields they were in, but somehow, um, it still worked.

You know, it's interesting, because as you're sitting here saying, the different perspectives, the fresh eyes, I love, the you know, the shape shift, what you have done, and you've continued to do so well, is given yourself an opportunity to step out of your comfort zone. There's a lot of people right now, very hesitant on stepping out of their comfort zone. Any any words of advice based on your years of experience around doing this, and we're going to get to that next relaunch. But anyway, around it's, it's, it's a big deal. It's a

big deal. And it's not a it's uncomfortable, as you said, when you know, I sometimes describe it as writing with your left hand, you still know how to write, you still know what the letters look like, but it takes you a while to figure it out. I guess I'll give you some words of advice and maybe some things that that to me don't seem like superpowers, but but can be so I think embracing the uncomfortable and knowing that it's going to be a little bit of a slog, a friend of mine said to me, in the midst of a job change, Embrace the suck. And he was right. I hope I can say that you have to embrace the fact that it's hard. Now, I happen to like hard. So for me, that's that is, well, it's still uncomfortable. I like the idea that if it were easy, everybody would do it, as they said in League of League of my own, so league of their own. So I would say, know that that's going to be the case and give yourself some time and patience and grace. I think we don't give ourselves grace. I think I can be impatient with myself. I think lots of people can, can feel that way. I would remind folks listening as I've reminded myself that is the growth that you gain in these times is really immeasurable. I think it's great mentally. I think it's what keeps you sharp as you continue to grow to age. What have you, because you are making, you know, it's, it's exercise for your mind, right? We exercise our bodies, but like this way, you're literally challenging yourself. It may not be doing Sudoku, but it's, it's something else. And then the last thing I'd say, I mentioned I'm a curious person, and I am. I also think in some ways I'm naive, and I have let that be a little bit of a engine for me. I don't I'm naive about how tough it can be, but that insulates me a little bit to the. The Woe is me. So I don't know a couple thoughts

that interesting, though. I don't, I mean, naive. I'm not sure that that's necessarily what. Because every time you know your curiosity, it's almost like you're you're you have this quest for newness and the challenges. And I, you know, I often say when I'm coaching people, I'm like, Okay, if you can go every single day and challenge yourself with one thing, it doesn't have to be a gigantic thing, but one thing at the end of the day, more power to you. And also, another thing that you you mentioned, which I really want people to hear, is that your perspective on failing, and we talked about it last time. Can you share how your view because it goes back to being naive, and it's like, hey, but you also have a very unique approach when something doesn't work out, your mindset on moving on. Yeah,

you know, I, I'm a competitive person. I like to win, but I hate to lose. Really. Hate to lose. And what I find is, you know, I'll use GE as an example, if I could, we, about seven years ago, really were going through a challenging time, financially, operationally, et cetera, well documented, and that has literally reversed itself at this point thanks to the hard work of the team there, CEO and the rest of the team. I remember saying this to you the last time we spoke, which is, I didn't want to leave when we were on a losing team. I just didn't it was not something I felt I could carry around. I didn't think I could look in the mirror. I didn't think I could look my teammates in the eye and just peace out when things weren't going well, and it hardened my resolve to fight for a better day. And I go back to that fact I hate to lose, and I just I didn't, I didn't want to be part of a losing team. And honestly, you know when, things are challenging, and you know, you can have a challenging day, you can have something really challenging happen in your life. There's, as you know, there's all kinds of relaunches, the relaunches, you know, every Tuesday, but this idea of knowing that you're playing for something more. You don't know what that's gonna look like, but I firmly believe in a better way. I firmly do, and I think it is a combination of some of what we're talking about. It's curiosity. I think it's hard work. You know, I do believe in hard work. I don't believe in a lot of shortcuts. Sometimes you get lucky, but most of the time, you make your own mock so that really that motivated me. And I think for, you know, the rest of my career, or perhaps the rest of my life, I will think back to that moment as you know, I could have been defeated, or, or, or said, Okay, this is not going to work. And I just, I think I would have lost. I think I would have lost as a human.

I I agree. Because if you can't just the way that you're describing it, it's one of these that I stayed at Oracle for almost 10 years, and I finally, and I thought I was a dinosaur at that point, because it was high tech and everyone was leaving, and you mentioned this whole idea that you don't ever want to quit, but you and I both grew up in a time period where it was a man's world. And there were definitely in you know, instances that you've mentioned, I've read about, that push the edge, and sometimes Did you ever feel, which because I did just so, you know, I did that. I was, I was a woman, but I was trying to act like a man. I was trying to be at the at the guys table in the boys club, and it never felt right. What? What about this? You know, the the boys club. How did you? How did you navigate through all of that? And did you, did you feel like you were a woman in a man's body, or a man in a woman's body, yeah, oh,

gosh, yes. I mean particularly because, you know, I've been, I've been working for God, close to 40 years. So, you know, over the early decades, absolutely, and to this day, you know, there, there was a time earlier. Week where I was one of a few women in a giant room of men. And so I'd say it gets easier as you get further in your career. I think I was emboldened along the way, because I realized Hillary, if I didn't use my voice, who else was going to use their voice? And I think as I look back to my younger me, I wish I could go back and give her advice and say, be bolder. Speak up more. Use your voice more. That's what I say to my daughter, that's what I say to young women who I work with. I wasn't that person. I wish I was. So all I can do now is is, is try to give that back. But I think the other thing I can do, you can do is to is to be the change example just one. When I'm asked to join a panel discussion, I won't do it if I'm the only woman on the panel, because I do not want to be the one I want to be surrounded by. So it's just a such a tactical example. But I think as women, we do have to carry as we climb, and I think that is harder sometimes when you're younger, although I hope less hard than it was for me.

I you know what? I'm nodding my head right now for those that can't stay because we're going to go into and I like the the whole idea about the wise woman that we are now, and if we could go back and give our our former self, our younger version of us, a little advice. But there's also the ability that we've made it through. We were scrappy enough that we got to where we are now. And you know, sometimes you think back and you're like, God, I wish, I wish I could have, I should have, I didn't, but it's all part of our growing. It's all part of that stage. I do want you to go back to you stayed at GE for a very long time, and as you said, yeah, there was always those points of wait. I can't go now, because now we have this issue I've got to solve. And then there was another one, how did you finally make a decision to leave, and how did that significantly affect the relaunch that you are going through right now?

Yeah, um, as I said, you know, seven years or so ago, it would have been easier to go than to stay, but I'm very glad I stayed. I don't want to equate myself to an athlete. I'm a terrible athlete, but I think you there is a part of you. There certainly was a part of me that knew that it was time to go do something else. Now for me, I think it was very fortunate in that it we decided, as I said, a few minutes ago, to separate the company into three. So that, to me, was the perfect moment, because there, I guess, twofold one I had the privilege of sort of seeing, overseeing the whole thing, and when it was time for it to become triplets, there were so many Wonderful people, some of whom were on my team, who had the opportunity to take that role at one of those three companies. And that was a joyous thing to say. It was joyous. And I felt as though I had done everything that I could do. I didn't leave a single thing on the table. I literally as my with my team, because this was not a solo exercise. We ran through the tape together, and at that point, I was good. I was good. The company was a great place. I was just I was ready. What's

interesting is that I can still remember the day I walked out of what we used to call the Emerald tower, the Oracle buildings. Yeah, and there was a little bit of this, like, who am I, yeah, like, I have been this person at Oracle for so long, yeah. How? I mean, how did you feel when all of a sudden, you know, you're a couple months after the identity it's like an identity crisis. It's an identity crisis of, I've always been known as CMO, of GM or GE, and now I'm and now what am I? I mean, it was,

it's really hard, and to say otherwise would just be lying. I mean, you know, you. Knew that, you know, I always think about like your email signature, your email address, you know, the Bob hat, you know, etc. And I know that I'm not what was after the ampersand on what's before the ampersand. I'm went off. But the association, as it was for you and Oracle, was so deeply embedded and and deeply loved. I mean, as I said, I love this company. I always will. I love what they stand for. Certainly, the people are extraordinary. So it is a little bit of an identity crisis. And I think, um, God, I don't know that I have any great advice, because it's hard. I think you have to know that you're not defined by your company. You're defined by who you are, how you act, how you treat people. But it was, it was peanut butter in my mouth. I can remember those those days the right way to say it, right? I mean, it was six months ago. It wasn't six years ago. And, you know, saying hello to people at a conference or, you know, out socially. And it just was, I kind of felt like, I don't know, left, left my sweater at home or something. It was just odd. It was odd, it was uncomfortable. But then you realize, you know, there are people who I think were very kind to me because of where I worked, and then I think there were people that were my real friends. You start to see that too.

And there is something to be said about as a woman, we identify ourselves with so many labels, and we have all these masks that we wear. And when you take off a significant one, and whether it's losing the Mrs. To the Mr. And a divorce, or whether it's losing the VP or the C suite title, or whatever it is, and you're leaving, and you have that moment of just being able to breathe in, you're like, oh boy,

you know, I'll tell you. This is just, just a super quick anecdote after leaving I this was only about a month ago. I was speaking at a conference with a with a couple other folks on stage in my new role. I wasn't at GE and a couple of people came up to me afterward, and they said, You know, I've heard you speak a bunch of times. I've never seen you so comfortable with who you are. You shed that corporate persona. Now, honestly, I didn't even think I had a corporate persona. I'm pretty casual. You know, what you see is what you get. But it was, I didn't even realize that

that's the thing. It's like a nesting doll. And you break open that, you know that first layer that where it goes, it kind of squeals. It goes, that squeaky sound when you're undoing that first and then you have the second. You go all the way down to the little one. I feel like there's a little of that. So we've got to talk about your relaunch that as you said, you know, it's been six months and already you are, you know, you couldn't wait long, somebody snatched you up. But tell us about this relaunch, because it is remarkable. Thank you.

So when I decided to leave GE I made a very short list. I very short list of what, more of what I didn't want to do than what I did, because I see, as a marketer, I see possibilities everywhere. Maybe that's, maybe that's a common trait, I don't know, and I didn't want to go to another brand. I sort of felt this, you know, monogamy, so to speak with with GE. It was a long marriage and a happy marriage, but I wanted to build and I wanted to work with a group of people that I sort of go to battle with. And so what I did, and what I'm doing, is I became CEO of an agency called said differently. That is a non traditional agency. Maybe not surprising, given everything we've talked about, and what I love about this job, and what I love about the agency is it's a model that is unexpected. Instead of having a, you know, a big group of people under a rooftop for any client, any brand, we find, who the best people are, regardless of where they are in the world, and that's who we put on any given client. And I thought, Wow, if I were back in my old role, I'd find this really intriguing. We were only four years old. We are growing which I love. We're building which I love, and it's familiar because it's the industry I know of marketing and brand and advertising and and the like. But it's also definitely writing with my left hand, because it's a it's it's the service side of the business. Business. It's the other side of the table. It's figuring out, is there a different way in which to service clients, go to markets? So it's, trust me, it's making my brain hurt every day, because, well,

in your wheelhouse, with different perspective than that, fresh eyes and hey, I'm willing to do a little shape shifting. I mean, even the name said differently, come on.

And that is credit to the founders. It's a great name. It's a great name. And it does, it's, it is. I've always you were kind to say this in in your lovely introduction. I believe a challenger mentality is a the right mentality. I also think it's so much more fun to be a challenger brand. We tried to GE show up like a challenger brand said differently. Absolutely has a challenger brand mindset and and I love that. So, so it's been great, but completely different. So

how did you know it was time to get back into something so different, because I'm often asked by clients, you know, I'm thinking about leaving this position, or I'm looking at a massive change, or I want to just start to get on boards now. And they they say, when is the right time? And for some they may say, Hey, you you jump fast like it came. I did best. And so what do you what do you say to people about that? Yeah,

I did jump fast. I am very energetic. I knew I wanted, I knew I wanted to continue to operate. So I have had the great good fortune to be on, and still am on some boards, so I know the the greatness of board work and and it's a privilege to be on a board.

Were you on boards prior to leaving GE I

was, I was I was on the Duncan board. And the way I would describe it is, for me, at least it wasn't the full meal. It was great side dishes. And I still wanted the full meal. I still, as I said, wanted to operate. So that was, that was helpful, because I think it's, it's a I have great friends who've said, No, I want to go the board route, and they've been and they're on a bunch of fantastic boards, and it's an amazing choice. It just wasn't my choice. So I would say I wasn't, I wasn't ready to to what song

I'm hearing in my mind right now. One more time.

I wanted one more ride. I wanted one more I still felt as though I had more to give. I had more to learn. And you know what Hillary this goes back to naivete, which I know, and I understand why you pushed a little bit there. There was a little bit of, why not, right? You know,

I call it the I can do that syndrome, where you're like, I can do that. Yeah, I think I can do that. I can do that. I think we might have it together,

together, and I think I didn't overthink the downsides, because that's who I am. I don't overthink the downsides, because my view is you can zig and zag and figure it out.

So I want to talk to you about midlife and this idea of really, some of the best women in history have started completely new careers later on in their life and and I really admire the people that say, you know, I'm not willing to just be and just sit and just do I want to make more things happen, which is what you're doing. But you also have a new grand baby, and you, when I asked you, I think it's a boy, is that? Right?

It's a girl, but that's

I think we talked about, we talked about your friend Katie Couric, who has a boy every time you talk babies. Okay, so the granddaughter, yes, how do you? How do you divide your time, because that is like such a I wish I could spend more time, more time, more time, but now you are CEO of a company. How do you manage it all?

I mean, you never manage it all. When my kids were young, it's so you and I. It's such a math I mean, you I think get in the zone when you are doing work. I think you get in a zone as a parent, as a grandparent, it's hard to not always be in the zone. But I don't I'm not a great juggler. I think when I am focused on work, I'm really focused on work. I may have said this, I can't remember when my kids were little, I coached my daughter in soccer, and I did that in some ways, Hillary, even though it was, you know, not something I had a ton of time for, because I wanted to be all in with her on something. And it was something I could do on the weekends, and it worked. And I'd say the same thing with my amazing little Mackenzie, my granddaughter, which is, you know, I I'm not there all the time, but, but there's no role for me to be there all the time. And when I am able to see her, which is, you know, at least every couple weeks, if not more than that, it's, you know, the rest of the world completely fades away, as I think grandparents just know it does, right? You know, you just are, you're, you're, you're so in that moment. But I don't know. I like variety. I love working I love working hard. I just couldn't, how could I say this? If I were trying to do it all at once, it would, it would, it would look like garbage. I try to be there. I try to be present for what I'm present for.

You really are, and you do a really good job with that. So let me ask you about what else is on the docket for Linda. What else do you are you saying? Hey, I'm still I still answer this question. I still want to what would you say?

One of the things I have not done a lot of is travel for pleasure. I've traveled a lot for business, a lot, a lot. But there are countries, gosh, there are continents that I haven't been to, and that is absolutely something that i i plan to and want to do. I hopefully will do it. I'll, you know, bring family, bring friends, bring my granddaughter at some point. So that's absolutely on the list. It's one of those things that I think needs a little bit of time and planning. And I put my time in planning other places so that that would definitely be one, but most. But

knowing this, I'm going to coach you a little bit. Yeah, please. The only way to make things happen is to calendar it, and as you sort of planning. So for somebody as busy as you, I have an amazing travel agent who plans what you want, and then you put it on your calendar, and you go, girl like, this is your time. So I'm gonna, I'm gonna tell you specifically. Okay, please bring it on. Please bring it on. Yes, it's rabbit for travel, and I'm going to give you all of the details. She's out in New York. Shelley, wow, wow, wow, wow. And another thing I do want as we wrap up here, because it's already been I told you this was going to go fast. I'd really love to hear from you, your take on people are having relaunches in their personal life right now, their business life, and we're also having global relaunches, yeah, and when you think about all of that, what? What are some of the things you do to keep yourself grounded?

I think they're going to be sounds so simple as to almost sound remedial. But I am a huge believer in a good night's sleep. There are few things in my mind that are more restorative than a good night's sleep. And I will often say, if there's a gnarly problem, or I'm not ready, I'll just say I'll sleep on it, and that has always been the case for me. I both. I love to read, love, love, love, new fiction, and I love to walk. So on the weekends, I will often take a really long walk with the dog while I listen to a book on Audible. And again, what I love about that is I have chosen a career that is grounded in many ways in storytelling. So I love listening to stories, but listening to completely different stories. So that does it. But I mean, in the end, it's my family who really grounds me? You know my kids and my husband and the baby, they keep me humble. They keep me honest. They keep me laughing. You know, that's

well. Thank you, Linda Boff, for being here. How can people find you? Follow you, get in touch with you. Oh,

I'm super easy. I'm on X, I'm on LinkedIn, I'm on Instagram, you know, Linda, saiddifferently.com. I'm super accessible. I have every communications channel. And if anybody who is listening in any way wants to talk about relaunching or share a story or just, you know, connect, it would be my pleasure.

Ah, again. Thank you so much for being here, and I knew this was going to be a great show, and you delivered the goods, girl. So congrats on your new position, and I am absolutely following you, following your successes, and can't wait to hear after you've been there a year, about how you have changed everything in the industry, because you said differently. Know how to do that. So everyone, thank you for being here. I hope you got as much out of this conversation as I did, and as I always say, you have to be thinking about relaunch, love, relaunch, life and relaunch now do not wait. Just like I said, Linda, get that trip planned. It's time. There's never been a better time than to relaunch today. We'll see you next week. Everyone, thanks again for being here.

Thank you so much. Hillary, thanks for everybody for listening. Bye.