How to Spot Red Flags: Avoid Dating a Narcissist! Insights from a Recovered Narcissist Ft. Jonathan

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Okay.

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Hello, beautiful humans.

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Welcome to the Midlife Revolution.

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I'm your host, Megan Conner.

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And tonight I am joined once

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again by Jonathan.

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Jonathan,

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thanks for being here with us tonight.

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Great to be here.

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Thanks for having me again.

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I just did a revamp and I

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changed everything.

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So it's all under the awakening expansion.

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So now TikTok,

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YouTube and Instagram is

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awakening expansion.

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Awesome.

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So I thought that tonight, this is our,

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I guess,

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our fourth time talking together.

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And our other episodes that

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we did were kind of deep dives.

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I think it's a helpful

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conversation to have.

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What are some of the red

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flags that come up when

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you're dating a narcissist

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or when you're in a

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relationship with a narcissist?

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And what should you do when

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you notice some of these red flags?

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So I have a little bit of a list,

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but I'm curious from your perspective.

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So for those of you who are

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joining us for the first

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time who don't know Jonathan,

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Jonathan is a former member

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of the Church of Jesus

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Christ of Latter-day Saints,

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as am I. Jonathan went

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through an entire

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deconstruction journey with addiction,

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relationship issues, and became...

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aware that he was using

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narcissistic traits in his

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relationship and is now a

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certified healer and is

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trying to help other, especially men,

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realize the manipulative

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tactics that they might be

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employing in their relationships.

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And what else do you want to

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say about that?

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Yeah, it's really exciting.

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It's really just going back

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to what I want my my

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channel and everything to

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be is really just

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understanding your conditioning,

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understanding your programing,

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understanding that that kind

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of voice inside your head

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isn't really you and the

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true you deep down in there

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is just pure light pure joy

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and has infinite capacity

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for love joy curiosity and

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and we get so bogged down

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with everything that we saw

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growing up everything that

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we were taught growing up

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and that really programmed

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us into something that

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might not be in alignment

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with with what we want and

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that can cause a lot of

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depression that can cause a lot of

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just really difficult times

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whereas you're able to

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explore that see where

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they're coming from and

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really heal through those

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uncomfortable times and

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those uncomfortable parts

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that you don't necessarily

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understand and beginning to

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see where they're coming

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from understanding they're

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there to protect you they

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may have learned

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maladaptive measures to do

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so but once you can kind of

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begin that journey with self-awareness

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You can see where a lot of

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these things came from and

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you can have a lot more

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compassion for yourself and

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then realize tapping right

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back into that little child

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and really having so much

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more room for self-expansion,

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capacity for love,

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for affection for others,

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for just outright

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unconditional love that

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maybe you didn't really

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even understand how to do.

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And that's kind of what I went through.

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What I was raised with

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taught me a lot of things,

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and as we've discussed in

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the LDS church specifically,

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it does foster and cater to

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a lot of narcissistic

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tendencies that can develop.

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And I'm simply trying to

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show people that that's not

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how it has to be,

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and that there truly is a way to heal,

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learn from those parts,

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and expand into...

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truly the highest self and

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the version of you that

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you've always wanted.

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It's all within you and it's achievable.

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That's awesome.

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I love that.

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okay so i'm thinking back to

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when i first got divorced

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and i was out there in the

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dating scene which i

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absolutely hated i did not

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enjoy it at all but um i

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think it was constantly

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like a sifting process of

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like going through you know

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looking at profiles and

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then messaging with

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somebody and then you

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finally find someone you do

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want to meet in person and

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then it's like the first date

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And then it's like, well,

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is there going to be a

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second date kind of thing?

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So I don't know about you

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out in the dating world, but for me,

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I was constantly looking for red flags.

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I was looking for it in our

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messaging before we even

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met up in person.

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Then I was looking for it in person,

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looking for body language,

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other things like that.

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So, you know, just given the fact that

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There are so many different

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personality styles out there.

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And there are plenty of

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people out there who have

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maybe some narcissistic traits,

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but who aren't necessarily

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a full-blown narcissist.

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So we don't want to kind of

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just put up a wall and say, oh,

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I'm never going to talk to

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anybody ever again.

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But we want to be informed

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about what some red flags might be.

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And then if we're currently

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in a relationship,

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it might be helpful for us

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to take some of these ideas

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and think about our

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interactions with our

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current partner and see how

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healthy our relationship is.

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So I don't know if you have

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a jumping off point that

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you want to go from or

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what's the best way to dive in.

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Yeah, well, we can start there for sure.

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And like you said,

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not everyone is a full-blown narcissist,

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but we all have narcissistic tendencies.

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Like,

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let's all just understand that and

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give ourselves some grace through society,

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through everything we live

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in and how this world works.

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We all do.

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that's okay it just becomes

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how much of it is our is

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their self-awareness is

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their accountability is

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there a desire to

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understand these things and

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so you mentioned right out

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dating we can kind of start

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there I would I would be on the prowl for

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Because obviously during the

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beginning of dating,

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we call getting to know

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each other honeymoon phase.

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You're on your best behavior.

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You're not really showing

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who you are fully.

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And that's okay.

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Let's all understand that

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that's kind of a part of dating.

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I wish it wasn't.

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But one thing to look for is...

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what what becomes toxic i

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think is a person is

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looking for something

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specific and you know

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you're kind of asking each

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other questions and you're

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loving that you're agreeing

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on something and then

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subconsciously like from a

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person who's had deep

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narcissistic tendencies um

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that i didn't realize but

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you're looking for them to

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fit this box right you're

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looking for them to fit into

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what I want.

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And, and in those beginning stages,

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a lot of times we cater to

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the other person because

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we're trying to say what we

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think they want.

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And that's,

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we're not getting into the

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realm of toxicity yet

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because you're trying to, you know,

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you're trying to accommodate,

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you're trying to find

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common ground and that's all okay.

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But I think

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So the first advice I would

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give is don't do that too much.

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Be who you are, first of all.

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And if there is a

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disagreement and you guys

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completely are not on the

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same page with something, that's okay.

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That's the beauty of growing

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and learning a new perspective.

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And so I think too often we see that as,

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oh,

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I've got to change this person or I've

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got to run.

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and that's that's

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understandable but let's

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first just start off like

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you're actually trying to

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get to know the person

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you're really trying to get

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to know them and you're not

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trying to meet the

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secretary the receptionist

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you're trying to get to

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meet them and you don't

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want to necessarily only

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see them on their best

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behavior you don't want to

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agree on everything and i

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think we can get caught up

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into that because it's like oh yes

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We agree on this politic.

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We agree on this.

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This is great.

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This is great.

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And that is great.

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But I think sometimes we can,

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we can get caught up in that.

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And before we know it,

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we ourselves have put on a

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mask to accommodate the

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other person and they may

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have done that too.

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And further down the line,

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that's going to lead to

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some very difficult situations.

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So maybe starting there, you know,

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in the early dating scene, right.

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Yeah.

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And I agree with you that it

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is wise to be somewhat guarded, to not,

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you know,

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give away all your secrets on

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the first date, you know,

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to reserve some things and

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to not necessarily, you know,

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come out and be a hundred

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percent vulnerable to overshare,

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to trauma dump,

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any of that kind of stuff

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when you're first meeting somebody.

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For me personally, I think

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what I keep coming back to

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all the time is that all

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relationships are about, well,

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all healthy relationships

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are about good communication.

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So for me,

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the first things that I notice are

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whether or not somebody is

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engaging in a conversation.

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Is this conversation two-way

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street or is it one-sided?

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Is this them telling me all

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about themselves and never

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asking me a question?

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Me trying to share something

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and then them steering it

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right back to their own

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description of themselves

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or whatever it is that they

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wanna tell me.

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So for me,

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that to me is the first thing

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that I notice is whether or

00:09:53.534 --> 00:09:55.255

not the conversation is a two-way street.

00:09:56.431 --> 00:09:57.312

Yes, absolutely.

00:09:57.352 --> 00:09:58.252

That's a great point.

00:09:59.093 --> 00:10:01.694

Because if it's truly a

00:10:01.714 --> 00:10:03.095

narcissist or someone who

00:10:03.155 --> 00:10:05.536

has deep tendencies, let's say,

00:10:06.057 --> 00:10:07.538

they're viewing this as an

00:10:07.618 --> 00:10:09.839

opportunity for a show.

00:10:10.862 --> 00:10:12.203

They are thinking of it in

00:10:12.263 --> 00:10:15.945

terms of how did I perform?

00:10:16.085 --> 00:10:17.165

Did she like me?

00:10:17.465 --> 00:10:19.566

Is she thinking about me now?

00:10:20.687 --> 00:10:22.768

How was my performance, right?

00:10:23.328 --> 00:10:26.210

And so, that's not how it should be,

00:10:26.670 --> 00:10:26.930

right?

00:10:27.050 --> 00:10:28.231

It really should be an

00:10:28.311 --> 00:10:30.852

opportunity for you two to

00:10:30.892 --> 00:10:31.993

get to know each other and

00:10:32.053 --> 00:10:33.273

it doesn't have to be like

00:10:33.413 --> 00:10:34.854

how you performed and I

00:10:34.894 --> 00:10:36.075

caught myself doing that.

00:10:37.294 --> 00:10:38.815

of trying to just perform really,

00:10:38.835 --> 00:10:39.315

really well.

00:10:39.996 --> 00:10:42.597

And so if you're trying to, you know,

00:10:43.878 --> 00:10:44.638

piece through some

00:10:44.778 --> 00:10:46.079

potential red flags is

00:10:46.179 --> 00:10:47.480

exactly what you said is,

00:10:47.920 --> 00:10:49.021

did they engage me?

00:10:49.061 --> 00:10:50.181

Were they genuinely

00:10:50.281 --> 00:10:52.182

interested in what I had to say?

00:10:52.242 --> 00:10:53.943

Was there some follow up questions?

00:10:54.464 --> 00:10:56.064

Or tell me more about that.

00:10:56.085 --> 00:10:57.625

That is fascinating, you know,

00:10:58.146 --> 00:10:59.646

instead of redirecting the

00:10:59.686 --> 00:11:02.268

conversation so that I can now present

00:11:02.668 --> 00:11:04.990

my genius or how great i am

00:11:05.270 --> 00:11:06.150

you know that's a that's a

00:11:06.251 --> 00:11:08.572

clear red flag that i would

00:11:08.612 --> 00:11:10.694

be concerned with as as

00:11:10.834 --> 00:11:13.155

charming as impressive as

00:11:13.295 --> 00:11:15.717

whatever it may be keep

00:11:15.777 --> 00:11:17.218

that tab and i think i

00:11:17.258 --> 00:11:19.460

always you know since i've

00:11:19.520 --> 00:11:20.780

learned that similar thing

00:11:20.820 --> 00:11:22.422

is do they ask me things

00:11:22.702 --> 00:11:23.462

you know are they

00:11:23.582 --> 00:11:26.384

interested in who i am do

00:11:26.404 --> 00:11:27.165

they really want to

00:11:27.245 --> 00:11:29.627

understand me and truly get

00:11:29.647 --> 00:11:31.648

to know me or is this a performance

00:11:33.643 --> 00:11:34.863

Yeah, that's a really good point.

00:11:35.003 --> 00:11:36.404

The performance aspect of it.

00:11:36.884 --> 00:11:37.404

Also,

00:11:37.844 --> 00:11:40.905

I think I can tell when somebody is

00:11:41.025 --> 00:11:43.105

listening to understand me

00:11:43.566 --> 00:11:45.986

versus listening to have a

00:11:46.046 --> 00:11:48.127

response to something, you know,

00:11:48.207 --> 00:11:49.447

I can sort of see them like

00:11:49.507 --> 00:11:50.887

holding that thought in their head.

00:11:50.987 --> 00:11:51.228

Okay.

00:11:51.268 --> 00:11:51.508

Okay.

00:11:51.588 --> 00:11:53.008

When, when she's done, then I'll,

00:11:53.128 --> 00:11:54.228

I'm going to say my thing.

00:11:54.768 --> 00:11:55.689

So just those first

00:11:55.729 --> 00:11:57.369

communication pieces to me,

00:11:57.909 --> 00:11:58.709

that's a big deal.

00:11:59.290 --> 00:12:00.590

And you know,

00:12:01.072 --> 00:12:01.733

It's again,

00:12:02.333 --> 00:12:04.074

I'm gonna preface all of this

00:12:04.114 --> 00:12:06.777

that we're talking about by saying, again,

00:12:07.037 --> 00:12:08.538

that just because you

00:12:08.598 --> 00:12:10.840

encounter a red flag or even two,

00:12:11.340 --> 00:12:13.542

it doesn't necessarily mean that, okay,

00:12:13.582 --> 00:12:14.022

we're done,

00:12:14.042 --> 00:12:14.663

we're gonna end the

00:12:14.683 --> 00:12:15.824

relationship right here.

00:12:15.844 --> 00:12:16.034

Sorry.

00:12:16.696 --> 00:12:17.757

We can just sort of make

00:12:17.857 --> 00:12:18.678

note of the things that

00:12:18.698 --> 00:12:21.179

we're noticing and sort of

00:12:21.219 --> 00:12:22.860

put that in the database, you know,

00:12:24.521 --> 00:12:25.302

just to inform

00:12:25.362 --> 00:12:26.743

conversations going forward.

00:12:28.649 --> 00:12:32.092

yes yeah telltale is is are

00:12:32.112 --> 00:12:34.053

they truly interested and

00:12:34.093 --> 00:12:35.214

like you said you can kind

00:12:35.254 --> 00:12:37.676

of start to see um if

00:12:37.716 --> 00:12:39.197

you're maybe finishing up

00:12:39.237 --> 00:12:41.558

your thought or you can see

00:12:41.579 --> 00:12:43.480

them react in a way to they

00:12:43.540 --> 00:12:44.681

now know what they're gonna

00:12:44.721 --> 00:12:47.483

say and honestly you can

00:12:47.503 --> 00:12:48.884

kind of check that um

00:12:50.227 --> 00:12:52.530

by maybe asking a follow-up question,

00:12:52.570 --> 00:12:54.872

but really just look at this as,

00:12:55.213 --> 00:12:56.715

is this person interested

00:12:57.235 --> 00:12:58.697

in getting to know who I am?

00:12:59.875 --> 00:13:02.797

You know, and like you said before,

00:13:03.157 --> 00:13:03.737

in the beginning,

00:13:04.037 --> 00:13:05.478

you don't want a trauma dump, right?

00:13:05.558 --> 00:13:06.439

We don't want to go there.

00:13:06.499 --> 00:13:07.879

And especially with a

00:13:07.919 --> 00:13:09.560

narcissist where there's

00:13:09.901 --> 00:13:11.621

this deep attraction or whatever,

00:13:11.662 --> 00:13:13.623

there is a desire to be

00:13:13.683 --> 00:13:15.444

vulnerable and reveal

00:13:15.464 --> 00:13:17.105

things because you feel

00:13:17.725 --> 00:13:19.066

this special feeling.

00:13:19.126 --> 00:13:20.226

Well, I hate to break it to you,

00:13:20.246 --> 00:13:21.147

that special feeling.

00:13:22.184 --> 00:13:23.525

isn't necessarily the sign

00:13:23.585 --> 00:13:25.045

of a secure relationship.

00:13:25.506 --> 00:13:26.766

That can be anxiety.

00:13:26.806 --> 00:13:30.188

That can be their emotional

00:13:30.708 --> 00:13:31.649

inavailability.

00:13:31.809 --> 00:13:33.630

So just be cognizant of that

00:13:33.690 --> 00:13:35.210

special butterfly feeling

00:13:35.251 --> 00:13:36.371

because it's not

00:13:36.831 --> 00:13:38.732

necessarily a good thing.

00:13:38.792 --> 00:13:40.153

It's something to notice and

00:13:40.473 --> 00:13:42.114

be cognizant of because

00:13:42.174 --> 00:13:43.635

that's not necessarily the

00:13:43.735 --> 00:13:45.536

universe or God saying this is the one.

00:13:46.416 --> 00:13:47.477

Your body is literally

00:13:47.517 --> 00:13:49.057

having an emotional

00:13:49.117 --> 00:13:50.238

response to something.

00:13:51.618 --> 00:13:51.838

Yeah.

00:13:51.898 --> 00:13:53.020

And a lot of times when it's

00:13:53.080 --> 00:13:54.061

a new relationship,

00:13:54.101 --> 00:13:55.262

that emotional response is

00:13:55.302 --> 00:13:56.163

just this is new.

00:13:56.223 --> 00:13:56.864

It's exciting.

00:13:56.904 --> 00:13:57.845

It's fun to be out.

00:13:57.905 --> 00:13:59.968

It's fun to be meeting somebody new.

00:14:00.628 --> 00:14:01.830

It doesn't necessarily mean

00:14:01.870 --> 00:14:03.031

that they're the one or

00:14:03.071 --> 00:14:03.952

that there's some kind of

00:14:03.992 --> 00:14:05.634

lightning bolt moment that's happening.

00:14:06.275 --> 00:14:06.815

So, again,

00:14:06.936 --> 00:14:08.898

just being observant in those

00:14:08.978 --> 00:14:11.000

early days and taking in the information,

00:14:11.040 --> 00:14:12.502

but not necessarily ignoring.

00:14:12.742 --> 00:14:14.604

taking action on it yet.

00:14:15.004 --> 00:14:17.086

Just learning all that we can.

00:14:17.746 --> 00:14:18.667

Yes.

00:14:19.548 --> 00:14:20.549

And someone with

00:14:20.609 --> 00:14:22.450

narcissistic tendencies

00:14:24.132 --> 00:14:27.975

will push the relationship and go very,

00:14:28.035 --> 00:14:28.776

very quickly.

00:14:29.416 --> 00:14:31.738

Things will escalate very, very quickly.

00:14:32.198 --> 00:14:34.520

And so please be aware of that.

00:14:34.941 --> 00:14:35.721

Be on your guard.

00:14:35.761 --> 00:14:38.043

There is never any reason to

00:14:38.143 --> 00:14:39.885

rush anything ever.

00:14:41.055 --> 00:14:44.657

ever, regardless of what they say.

00:14:44.818 --> 00:14:46.679

So just be aware of that.

00:14:46.779 --> 00:14:48.120

If you sense that they are

00:14:48.160 --> 00:14:50.501

starting to want to maybe

00:14:50.561 --> 00:14:52.763

get into the trauma quickly,

00:14:53.904 --> 00:14:55.224

just be aware of that.

00:14:55.405 --> 00:14:56.545

And as we've said before,

00:14:56.585 --> 00:14:58.607

boundaries are really important.

00:14:59.307 --> 00:15:00.648

And if this is a great

00:15:00.688 --> 00:15:02.809

person and they truly were

00:15:02.849 --> 00:15:04.110

just maybe a little excited,

00:15:05.131 --> 00:15:06.532

they're going to respect that boundary.

00:15:06.996 --> 00:15:07.156

Yeah.

00:15:07.176 --> 00:15:08.716

The other thing is, you know,

00:15:08.996 --> 00:15:10.457

we hear a lot about the

00:15:10.537 --> 00:15:12.117

love bombing phase in a

00:15:12.157 --> 00:15:13.938

narcissistic relationship cycle.

00:15:14.418 --> 00:15:15.878

And for whatever reason,

00:15:16.118 --> 00:15:17.018

that has never really

00:15:17.078 --> 00:15:18.419

resonated with me as

00:15:18.459 --> 00:15:19.479

something that I could

00:15:19.639 --> 00:15:21.580

easily pick out as a red flag,

00:15:21.620 --> 00:15:23.320

because I think all new

00:15:23.360 --> 00:15:24.680

relationships go through a

00:15:24.740 --> 00:15:26.981

phase where it's new, it's exciting.

00:15:27.621 --> 00:15:29.202

You're maybe texting each other a lot.

00:15:29.222 --> 00:15:30.443

You're calling each other a lot.

00:15:30.483 --> 00:15:32.024

There's a desire to spend a

00:15:32.064 --> 00:15:33.105

lot of time together,

00:15:33.305 --> 00:15:34.847

as much time together as possible.

00:15:35.607 --> 00:15:37.248

I don't necessarily see that

00:15:37.288 --> 00:15:37.969

as a red flag.

00:15:38.029 --> 00:15:39.510

I think all relationships go

00:15:39.570 --> 00:15:41.712

through that particular phase.

00:15:42.232 --> 00:15:42.953

For me,

00:15:43.313 --> 00:15:45.054

where love bombing becomes a red

00:15:45.255 --> 00:15:47.356

flag is when it follows a

00:15:47.476 --> 00:15:50.258

cycle of like we had a fight,

00:15:50.298 --> 00:15:51.459

we had an argument,

00:15:52.420 --> 00:15:53.921

we disagreed about something,

00:15:53.961 --> 00:15:54.962

it was pretty bad.

00:15:55.703 --> 00:15:56.803

And then all of a sudden,

00:15:57.764 --> 00:15:59.105

Just a short time later,

00:15:59.685 --> 00:16:01.166

we're back with love bombing again.

00:16:01.887 --> 00:16:02.127

You know,

00:16:02.467 --> 00:16:05.169

that excessive apologizing or

00:16:05.209 --> 00:16:06.790

buying big expensive gifts

00:16:06.870 --> 00:16:08.211

or the big fancy dinners or

00:16:08.251 --> 00:16:08.871

things like that.

00:16:09.371 --> 00:16:10.512

I don't know how much of

00:16:10.532 --> 00:16:12.954

that you experienced or participated in,

00:16:12.994 --> 00:16:14.395

but if you want to comment

00:16:14.435 --> 00:16:14.935

on that or not.

00:16:16.989 --> 00:16:20.293

yeah sure so um yeah love

00:16:20.313 --> 00:16:22.015

bombing is is tricky

00:16:22.575 --> 00:16:24.677

because obviously in the

00:16:24.697 --> 00:16:25.759

beginning you're excited

00:16:26.339 --> 00:16:28.041

and um you're wanting to

00:16:28.101 --> 00:16:30.364

impress and you're you're

00:16:30.724 --> 00:16:31.645

you're excited about the

00:16:31.685 --> 00:16:33.707

potential and you see

00:16:33.747 --> 00:16:34.928

someone that you like being

00:16:34.969 --> 00:16:37.271

around and so your behavior is going to

00:16:38.352 --> 00:16:39.094

show that.

00:16:39.795 --> 00:16:41.760

So the love doing a lot

00:16:41.820 --> 00:16:43.684

deeper dive right into

00:16:43.764 --> 00:16:45.528

understanding narcissistic

00:16:45.568 --> 00:16:46.891

tendencies and so forth.

00:16:47.191 --> 00:16:47.312

Um

00:16:49.329 --> 00:16:51.050

Because in my situation,

00:16:51.990 --> 00:16:53.230

she did want to take it

00:16:53.270 --> 00:16:55.091

slower and I did push for that.

00:16:55.251 --> 00:16:56.211

And looking back,

00:16:56.431 --> 00:16:57.471

I didn't necessarily even

00:16:57.531 --> 00:16:59.032

understand why I wanted to do that.

00:17:00.432 --> 00:17:02.312

But if you take a really

00:17:02.332 --> 00:17:03.713

deep dive into that,

00:17:04.093 --> 00:17:08.814

the reason is that wearing that mask

00:17:10.083 --> 00:17:11.524

we'll just assume, you know,

00:17:11.544 --> 00:17:12.444

during the love bombing

00:17:12.484 --> 00:17:14.806

which is I want to get

00:17:14.866 --> 00:17:18.108

supply from you and I want

00:17:18.128 --> 00:17:20.009

to be able to remove my

00:17:20.049 --> 00:17:22.231

mask as quickly as possible, right?

00:17:22.251 --> 00:17:23.351

Because it's exhausting.

00:17:23.731 --> 00:17:24.032

So,

00:17:24.412 --> 00:17:27.074

a reason that true narcissistic

00:17:27.114 --> 00:17:29.435

disorder people do that is

00:17:29.575 --> 00:17:30.516

they're trying to get you

00:17:30.576 --> 00:17:32.257

quick so that they can get

00:17:32.297 --> 00:17:33.818

you and remove the mask.

00:17:34.378 --> 00:17:36.299

And they don't have to really try anymore,

00:17:36.840 --> 00:17:37.760

if that makes sense.

00:17:37.820 --> 00:17:39.502

So that's where the love

00:17:39.542 --> 00:17:41.263

bombing becomes toxic.

00:17:41.323 --> 00:17:42.564

But a perfectly normal

00:17:42.604 --> 00:17:44.665

person in the beginning can

00:17:44.745 --> 00:17:46.506

totally express love and

00:17:46.566 --> 00:17:48.267

show admiration and really

00:17:48.328 --> 00:17:52.030

try to impress and have a good time.

00:17:52.650 --> 00:17:53.351

Those are fun,

00:17:53.851 --> 00:17:55.673

precious memories that you can create.

00:17:56.173 --> 00:17:56.953

Now, yes,

00:17:57.414 --> 00:18:00.276

when conflict does arrive and

00:18:00.356 --> 00:18:01.857

perhaps a mask comes off

00:18:01.897 --> 00:18:03.378

and there is a fight or something,

00:18:06.296 --> 00:18:07.817

what you wanna be cognizant

00:18:07.877 --> 00:18:10.119

of and look out for is you

00:18:10.179 --> 00:18:12.562

really want true conflict resolution.

00:18:13.122 --> 00:18:15.885

You do not want just the

00:18:15.925 --> 00:18:17.506

love bombing or the

00:18:17.546 --> 00:18:18.447

emotionality or

00:18:18.487 --> 00:18:20.049

vulnerability to just get

00:18:20.149 --> 00:18:22.872

back to baseline, right?

00:18:23.172 --> 00:18:24.613

Because getting back to baseline

00:18:25.678 --> 00:18:27.080

over a long period of time

00:18:27.180 --> 00:18:29.643

is dissatisfying for the other person.

00:18:30.003 --> 00:18:30.824

They're unhappy.

00:18:31.365 --> 00:18:31.605

Well,

00:18:31.645 --> 00:18:32.966

getting back to baseline for a

00:18:33.026 --> 00:18:35.449

narcissist is happy, is comfort,

00:18:36.090 --> 00:18:38.673

is what they're trying to

00:18:38.693 --> 00:18:40.134

get back to versus

00:18:40.695 --> 00:18:43.377

we're going to have a really understanding,

00:18:43.677 --> 00:18:45.498

loving conflict resolution

00:18:46.418 --> 00:18:48.440

situation where you feel heard,

00:18:49.160 --> 00:18:49.860

I feel heard,

00:18:50.201 --> 00:18:53.503

I understand what the misstep was,

00:18:53.543 --> 00:18:55.063

what the miscommunication was,

00:18:55.624 --> 00:18:56.965

and now there's going to be

00:18:56.985 --> 00:18:59.826

a commitment to change in moving forward.

00:19:00.447 --> 00:19:01.727

It shouldn't just be let's

00:19:01.767 --> 00:19:03.969

get back to the lovey-dovey

00:19:04.849 --> 00:19:06.670

stage of now we're back in

00:19:06.690 --> 00:19:07.591

our comfort zone.

00:19:08.434 --> 00:19:08.734

Yeah,

00:19:08.754 --> 00:19:10.896

so that's definitely something that I

00:19:11.057 --> 00:19:13.098

look out for is how do

00:19:13.138 --> 00:19:14.780

people handle conflict and

00:19:14.820 --> 00:19:16.362

how do they take criticism?

00:19:16.462 --> 00:19:18.283

Are they able to receive

00:19:18.323 --> 00:19:20.405

criticism without shame?

00:19:21.186 --> 00:19:22.147

Are they able to give

00:19:22.187 --> 00:19:23.548

criticism without judgment?

00:19:24.309 --> 00:19:25.831

And then when a conflict arises,

00:19:25.871 --> 00:19:26.771

how do they handle that?

00:19:26.831 --> 00:19:29.674

Are they able to regulate their emotions,

00:19:29.874 --> 00:19:30.875

manage their anger?

00:19:32.397 --> 00:19:34.478

And then, as you say,

00:19:34.678 --> 00:19:35.999

I think probably the most

00:19:36.059 --> 00:19:37.520

important piece of that is

00:19:37.580 --> 00:19:39.422

the repair after conflict.

00:19:40.122 --> 00:19:41.663

Are they able to make that

00:19:41.703 --> 00:19:42.684

relational repair?

00:19:43.225 --> 00:19:46.127

Are they able to take it back into, okay,

00:19:46.167 --> 00:19:47.848

can we come to an understanding?

00:19:48.028 --> 00:19:50.670

Here's a resolution type of situation.

00:19:50.990 --> 00:19:52.512

Or are they going to punish

00:19:52.552 --> 00:19:54.513

you with things like the silent treatment,

00:19:54.533 --> 00:19:55.814

the cold shoulder treatment?

00:19:55.954 --> 00:19:56.194

You know,

00:19:56.234 --> 00:19:57.915

are they going to try to get you

00:19:57.955 --> 00:19:59.596

to suffer because you've

00:19:59.636 --> 00:20:00.536

had this conflict?

00:20:00.576 --> 00:20:02.357

So that's another thing that

00:20:02.397 --> 00:20:03.598

I think is really important

00:20:03.638 --> 00:20:04.538

that I look out for.

00:20:05.419 --> 00:20:05.859

Yes.

00:20:06.739 --> 00:20:08.400

If they are overly defensive,

00:20:10.721 --> 00:20:12.622

that is that is not a good sign.

00:20:13.442 --> 00:20:15.083

If they immediately feel

00:20:15.183 --> 00:20:18.045

attacked at any request or

00:20:18.145 --> 00:20:20.105

bid that you put out,

00:20:21.646 --> 00:20:23.427

that's that's just not a good sign.

00:20:24.187 --> 00:20:25.168

And and maybe

00:20:26.270 --> 00:20:26.590

you know,

00:20:26.610 --> 00:20:29.232

thinking back of how that could have,

00:20:29.552 --> 00:20:30.433

what could have helped me

00:20:30.513 --> 00:20:31.814

better in that situation is,

00:20:34.475 --> 00:20:35.796

is if you do see that,

00:20:37.658 --> 00:20:39.239

in a calm manner, just be like,

00:20:39.560 --> 00:20:41.041

I feel like you're getting

00:20:41.501 --> 00:20:44.684

very defensive about what I am saying.

00:20:46.205 --> 00:20:47.926

Can you walk me through that?

00:20:47.967 --> 00:20:48.107

Like,

00:20:48.147 --> 00:20:49.408

what are you feeling and what are the

00:20:49.428 --> 00:20:50.248

thoughts that you're

00:20:50.288 --> 00:20:51.970

experiencing right now as

00:20:52.030 --> 00:20:55.753

I'm saying this and asking for this?

00:20:56.093 --> 00:20:58.915

What about that makes you defensive,

00:20:59.116 --> 00:20:59.436

you know?

00:21:01.611 --> 00:21:02.652

And I think it's always good

00:21:02.812 --> 00:21:04.093

if they're willing to open

00:21:04.213 --> 00:21:05.274

up and maybe they even

00:21:05.314 --> 00:21:06.615

catch themselves because

00:21:07.035 --> 00:21:07.976

most people with

00:21:08.036 --> 00:21:09.137

narcissistic tendencies

00:21:09.157 --> 00:21:09.777

don't think they're a

00:21:09.837 --> 00:21:10.938

narcissist and they don't

00:21:10.978 --> 00:21:11.638

think that getting

00:21:11.698 --> 00:21:13.600

defensive is necessarily narcissistic.

00:21:13.640 --> 00:21:14.841

And it doesn't have to be.

00:21:14.901 --> 00:21:15.401

It's not.

00:21:15.681 --> 00:21:16.562

It's a pattern.

00:21:17.263 --> 00:21:19.124

And it's a willingness to,

00:21:19.384 --> 00:21:21.225

as we always say, take accountability.

00:21:21.666 --> 00:21:23.227

And one way to not take

00:21:23.267 --> 00:21:24.308

accountability is to

00:21:24.328 --> 00:21:25.729

deflect and turn it around

00:21:26.369 --> 00:21:27.350

and get very defensive.

00:21:27.961 --> 00:21:30.303

So that taking accountability piece,

00:21:30.844 --> 00:21:33.306

you know, it can show up in small ways,

00:21:33.426 --> 00:21:34.607

especially early on in a

00:21:34.687 --> 00:21:35.628

dating relationship.

00:21:36.889 --> 00:21:37.189

You know,

00:21:37.529 --> 00:21:39.191

it looks like blaming everything

00:21:39.231 --> 00:21:40.392

on the waiter instead of

00:21:40.432 --> 00:21:41.713

taking responsibility for

00:21:41.733 --> 00:21:42.874

your own actions.

00:21:43.074 --> 00:21:44.356

you know actions during the

00:21:44.376 --> 00:21:47.341

dinner or whatever so we

00:21:47.381 --> 00:21:48.582

can always have in our

00:21:48.623 --> 00:21:49.864

minds sort of those

00:21:50.325 --> 00:21:51.587

narcissistic traits to be

00:21:51.647 --> 00:21:53.229

on the lookout for and the

00:21:53.249 --> 00:21:54.952

ways that they show up in

00:21:55.373 --> 00:21:56.154

you know a dating

00:21:56.194 --> 00:21:58.137

relationship or an early on relationship

00:21:58.657 --> 00:21:59.638

So I think about that

00:21:59.879 --> 00:22:02.241

inability to take responsibility.

00:22:02.482 --> 00:22:04.224

That I think is probably the

00:22:04.244 --> 00:22:04.965

biggest piece.

00:22:05.105 --> 00:22:05.505

For me,

00:22:05.545 --> 00:22:07.407

that's the biggest red flag that I

00:22:07.447 --> 00:22:08.148

watch out for.

00:22:08.649 --> 00:22:10.131

Are they able to apologize?

00:22:10.251 --> 00:22:11.913

Are they able to say, oh,

00:22:11.973 --> 00:22:13.615

I should have handled that differently,

00:22:13.895 --> 00:22:14.175

you know?

00:22:15.717 --> 00:22:17.018

And then that need for

00:22:17.058 --> 00:22:18.860

constant praise or approval

00:22:18.940 --> 00:22:20.321

can look like fishing for

00:22:20.381 --> 00:22:22.062

compliments or constantly

00:22:22.103 --> 00:22:22.863

talking about their

00:22:22.903 --> 00:22:23.924

accomplishments or their

00:22:23.964 --> 00:22:24.945

achievements or whatever.

00:22:26.046 --> 00:22:26.827

What are some of the other

00:22:26.867 --> 00:22:28.368

things that stand out to

00:22:28.408 --> 00:22:29.269

you in that area?

00:22:29.970 --> 00:22:30.150

Yeah,

00:22:30.170 --> 00:22:32.232

so getting back to the accountability,

00:22:35.294 --> 00:22:39.238

a lot of excuses were presented.

00:22:39.298 --> 00:22:40.999

Very rarely was it ever just like,

00:22:41.019 --> 00:22:41.480

you know what?

00:22:42.217 --> 00:22:42.877

you are right,

00:22:43.338 --> 00:22:46.379

I completely forgot or I did

00:22:46.440 --> 00:22:48.101

not put enough effort into that.

00:22:48.461 --> 00:22:52.163

I should have absolutely did that.

00:22:52.583 --> 00:22:53.624

There was always a reason

00:22:54.164 --> 00:22:57.106

why that commitment or

00:22:57.166 --> 00:22:58.567

whatever it was wasn't able

00:22:58.607 --> 00:23:00.268

to be fulfilled as

00:23:00.528 --> 00:23:02.709

requested and agreed upon, right?

00:23:02.729 --> 00:23:06.331

There was always an excuse to downgrade it,

00:23:06.351 --> 00:23:07.492

right?

00:23:08.470 --> 00:23:10.111

And I would be very careful

00:23:10.292 --> 00:23:11.853

of looking at that.

00:23:13.394 --> 00:23:16.216

Excuses happen, right?

00:23:16.256 --> 00:23:18.337

But if you start to see a pattern of that,

00:23:20.039 --> 00:23:22.581

I think that's really, really crucial.

00:23:22.681 --> 00:23:25.903

And it's a way that someone, you know,

00:23:26.243 --> 00:23:27.844

that I went through is able

00:23:27.884 --> 00:23:31.187

to literally in my own head justify it.

00:23:32.225 --> 00:23:32.819

that can be

00:23:32.839 --> 00:23:34.521

really tough to grapple

00:23:34.541 --> 00:23:34.882

with

00:23:34.882 --> 00:23:35.306

when

00:23:35.326 --> 00:23:37.409

you confront someone with a

00:23:37.449 --> 00:23:38.811

problematic behavior how do

00:23:38.831 --> 00:23:40.794

they respond you know

00:23:40.814 --> 00:23:41.615

that's a big part of it

00:23:42.612 --> 00:23:42.792

Yeah.

00:23:42.852 --> 00:23:44.133

And I think, you know,

00:23:44.213 --> 00:23:45.914

in that honeymoon phase or

00:23:45.954 --> 00:23:46.835

the love bombing,

00:23:48.195 --> 00:23:49.516

that is why that kind of

00:23:49.756 --> 00:23:51.217

happens is they're avoiding

00:23:51.257 --> 00:23:53.098

that at all costs because they don't want,

00:23:54.960 --> 00:23:55.680

sometimes they don't even

00:23:55.700 --> 00:23:57.481

trust themselves or they

00:23:57.521 --> 00:23:58.622

fear themselves of what

00:23:58.642 --> 00:24:00.043

they'll say if there is a

00:24:00.103 --> 00:24:01.223

disagreement or something.

00:24:01.263 --> 00:24:04.025

So I think that is why it

00:24:04.085 --> 00:24:06.166

can be prolonged so long

00:24:06.747 --> 00:24:08.668

and maybe pushing into the

00:24:09.460 --> 00:24:09.700

you know,

00:24:09.740 --> 00:24:10.840

moving in with each other or

00:24:10.880 --> 00:24:12.641

pushing into a serious

00:24:12.661 --> 00:24:13.881

committed relationship

00:24:14.121 --> 00:24:15.862

happens sooner so that when

00:24:15.902 --> 00:24:17.822

those things do arise,

00:24:18.563 --> 00:24:21.564

you assume that you guys

00:24:21.624 --> 00:24:23.804

are in too deep and she won't,

00:24:24.224 --> 00:24:27.525

or he won't leave.

00:24:27.565 --> 00:24:28.325

Yeah, for sure.

00:24:29.366 --> 00:24:30.826

So I guess that kind of

00:24:30.846 --> 00:24:33.807

brings me to my other, you know, the,

00:24:33.867 --> 00:24:35.087

the last point that I sort

00:24:35.127 --> 00:24:36.788

of wanted to touch on is, um,

00:24:37.981 --> 00:24:40.542

when you enact or enforce a

00:24:40.602 --> 00:24:41.703

personal boundary,

00:24:42.183 --> 00:24:43.523

how does the other person react?

00:24:43.964 --> 00:24:44.924

So for example,

00:24:45.684 --> 00:24:46.745

you're saying the person is

00:24:46.765 --> 00:24:48.466

gonna push to move in

00:24:48.506 --> 00:24:49.626

together really soon.

00:24:49.646 --> 00:24:49.807

We

00:24:49.807 --> 00:24:51.728

to me, looking at, okay,

00:24:51.768 --> 00:24:52.889

what does it look like if I

00:24:52.909 --> 00:24:54.230

give some pushback about that?

00:24:54.290 --> 00:24:55.011

If I say, hey,

00:24:55.111 --> 00:24:56.512

I'm not quite ready for that yet.

00:24:57.304 --> 00:24:58.505

How do they respond to that?

00:24:59.105 --> 00:25:00.946

Do they get super angry and

00:25:01.006 --> 00:25:02.947

start trying to say that, you know,

00:25:03.127 --> 00:25:04.688

guilt trip you, say that you don't really,

00:25:04.828 --> 00:25:06.489

you must not really care about me,

00:25:07.150 --> 00:25:08.651

you know, those kinds of excuses.

00:25:08.791 --> 00:25:09.671

Or do they say, hey,

00:25:09.691 --> 00:25:11.052

that's totally understandable.

00:25:11.713 --> 00:25:12.733

You know, I get it.

00:25:12.853 --> 00:25:14.674

Are they coming at it from a

00:25:14.714 --> 00:25:15.975

place of understanding and

00:25:16.035 --> 00:25:17.376

like wanting to get to know

00:25:17.876 --> 00:25:19.717

you and why you feel this way?

00:25:20.298 --> 00:25:21.518

Or are they just defensive

00:25:21.798 --> 00:25:24.120

and wanting to control the situation?

00:25:25.111 --> 00:25:27.513

Yeah, absolutely spot on, Megan, again.

00:25:27.773 --> 00:25:28.694

And I kind of want to bring

00:25:28.734 --> 00:25:30.195

up maybe a little less

00:25:30.295 --> 00:25:31.856

obvious one because I

00:25:32.396 --> 00:25:34.158

didn't realize this was

00:25:34.218 --> 00:25:36.439

going on at the time.

00:25:36.779 --> 00:25:39.061

But it's not going to be as

00:25:39.241 --> 00:25:42.163

obvious as they immediately

00:25:42.223 --> 00:25:43.344

get ticked off and start

00:25:43.384 --> 00:25:44.485

yelling at you at the first

00:25:44.525 --> 00:25:46.366

time you challenge or set a boundary.

00:25:46.727 --> 00:25:48.568

No, it doesn't have to be that obvious.

00:25:50.449 --> 00:25:52.611

It can be true, heartfelt...

00:25:55.959 --> 00:25:57.880

know have traits that they

00:25:57.900 --> 00:25:58.820

don't even realize they

00:25:58.880 --> 00:26:01.141

have that they these these

00:26:01.181 --> 00:26:02.322

things are ingrained and

00:26:02.522 --> 00:26:03.422

and if they haven't done

00:26:03.462 --> 00:26:04.563

the work they don't even

00:26:04.603 --> 00:26:05.523

know they're there so it

00:26:05.543 --> 00:26:07.624

can be really tricky and so

00:26:07.704 --> 00:26:08.704

i'm just going to be honest

00:26:08.744 --> 00:26:09.705

and kind of point out some

00:26:09.725 --> 00:26:11.565

things that um in those

00:26:11.605 --> 00:26:13.126

situations you have to be

00:26:13.146 --> 00:26:16.788

really careful of um in in

00:26:16.868 --> 00:26:18.148

my mind or in the mind of

00:26:18.188 --> 00:26:19.329

someone with narcissistic

00:26:19.369 --> 00:26:22.070

tendencies they really believe

00:26:23.423 --> 00:26:26.004

A, what they feel and B, what they say.

00:26:26.605 --> 00:26:28.245

They really believe that.

00:26:29.146 --> 00:26:31.467

So if there's a boundary and

00:26:32.127 --> 00:26:33.748

maybe in a skewed way,

00:26:33.948 --> 00:26:35.248

I view that as you're

00:26:35.288 --> 00:26:36.869

trying to distance yourself

00:26:36.889 --> 00:26:39.110

from me and you're really

00:26:39.170 --> 00:26:40.671

not wanting to get as close

00:26:40.711 --> 00:26:42.912

to me as I want to get to you.

00:26:43.752 --> 00:26:45.794

then you know in my brain

00:26:45.854 --> 00:26:47.255

that's that's that's a red

00:26:47.275 --> 00:26:48.275

flag for me because i'm

00:26:48.335 --> 00:26:50.677

like i'm i love and care

00:26:50.697 --> 00:26:51.698

about you more than you

00:26:51.738 --> 00:26:53.279

love and care about me and

00:26:53.299 --> 00:26:55.660

you actually believe that

00:26:56.401 --> 00:26:59.763

and and that's not good um

00:26:59.783 --> 00:27:01.204

so i'm just trying to maybe

00:27:01.264 --> 00:27:02.525

call out some things that

00:27:02.986 --> 00:27:04.487

it's never it's not always

00:27:04.527 --> 00:27:05.828

just gonna be that he he

00:27:06.688 --> 00:27:08.229

yells at you and causes

00:27:08.289 --> 00:27:09.749

violence when you bring up

00:27:09.769 --> 00:27:11.570

a boundary no like he

00:27:11.690 --> 00:27:13.710

really or she or whoever

00:27:14.871 --> 00:27:16.111

believes that they're in

00:27:16.171 --> 00:27:19.452

love and they're they're on

00:27:19.472 --> 00:27:21.613

a one-track mind to be with

00:27:21.653 --> 00:27:22.853

you the rest of your life

00:27:22.933 --> 00:27:25.054

and get you and live

00:27:25.074 --> 00:27:26.374

happily ever after like

00:27:26.514 --> 00:27:27.535

those were feelings that I

00:27:27.595 --> 00:27:30.896

had and I was concerned that maybe

00:27:32.068 --> 00:27:34.550

she didn't love me as much as I loved her.

00:27:35.330 --> 00:27:36.311

And so that was,

00:27:36.471 --> 00:27:37.851

that was brought up and it

00:27:37.992 --> 00:27:38.992

makes me cringe a little

00:27:39.012 --> 00:27:40.233

bit now talking about it,

00:27:40.273 --> 00:27:42.614

but it's not always going to be like,

00:27:42.934 --> 00:27:44.635

you know, Oh, you're setting a boundary.

00:27:44.675 --> 00:27:45.296

How dare you?

00:27:45.356 --> 00:27:48.878

It's like hurt.

00:27:48.958 --> 00:27:51.619

Like, Oh my gosh, this is threatening my,

00:27:52.220 --> 00:27:53.520

you know, self-esteem.

00:27:54.161 --> 00:27:55.662

I need your validation.

00:27:55.702 --> 00:27:57.643

And I'm interpreting that as

00:27:58.423 --> 00:27:59.964

you don't want this as much as me.

00:28:00.004 --> 00:28:00.985

And that's devastating.

00:28:02.253 --> 00:28:06.139

So just, I guess, watch out for that,

00:28:06.199 --> 00:28:06.559

you know,

00:28:07.280 --> 00:28:10.024

because it's not always as

00:28:10.104 --> 00:28:11.294

obvious as you think.

00:28:11.294 --> 00:28:11.610

welcome.

00:28:11.650 --> 00:28:12.670

So many of us have

00:28:12.751 --> 00:28:14.292

abandonment wounds and we

00:28:14.352 --> 00:28:15.352

don't realize it.

00:28:16.193 --> 00:28:17.794

And we don't realize that

00:28:17.834 --> 00:28:18.935

that's what's happening

00:28:18.975 --> 00:28:20.616

when someone puts up a

00:28:20.656 --> 00:28:22.057

boundary or they take a

00:28:22.097 --> 00:28:24.359

step back or even they say, slow down,

00:28:24.859 --> 00:28:25.980

not ready for that yet.

00:28:26.120 --> 00:28:27.421

A lot of that feels like

00:28:27.441 --> 00:28:28.842

abandonment to those of us

00:28:28.882 --> 00:28:30.223

who have that wound.

00:28:30.943 --> 00:28:33.584

And so when the relationship

00:28:33.624 --> 00:28:34.484

isn't going the way that

00:28:34.524 --> 00:28:35.564

you think it ought to or

00:28:35.584 --> 00:28:36.844

the way that you want it to,

00:28:37.184 --> 00:28:38.405

it's really easy to get

00:28:38.425 --> 00:28:41.145

offended and upset and

00:28:41.285 --> 00:28:42.065

blame it on the other

00:28:42.125 --> 00:28:44.546

person rather than saying, okay,

00:28:45.366 --> 00:28:46.306

I'm upset right now.

00:28:46.526 --> 00:28:49.047

It's not your fault for

00:28:49.107 --> 00:28:50.467

wanting the relationship to

00:28:50.507 --> 00:28:52.407

progress and I don't or vice versa,

00:28:52.527 --> 00:28:53.468

right?

00:28:53.488 --> 00:28:55.488

What we have to take a look at is, huh,

00:28:55.848 --> 00:28:57.588

I'm having some emotions

00:28:57.628 --> 00:28:59.189

come up that feel scary to me.

00:28:59.229 --> 00:28:59.969

I don't like them.

00:29:00.789 --> 00:29:01.830

It's not your fault.

00:29:01.970 --> 00:29:03.030

This is something that is

00:29:03.070 --> 00:29:04.571

coming from my side of the street.

00:29:05.092 --> 00:29:08.073

So I need to be the one to unpack that.

00:29:08.193 --> 00:29:09.774

I need to meditate.

00:29:09.874 --> 00:29:10.594

I need to journal.

00:29:10.654 --> 00:29:11.715

I need to figure out why I'm

00:29:11.755 --> 00:29:13.716

feeling this way because

00:29:13.816 --> 00:29:16.077

nine times out of ten in a

00:29:16.117 --> 00:29:17.138

healthy relationship,

00:29:17.858 --> 00:29:19.219

It's going to be something

00:29:19.259 --> 00:29:20.300

that either you or your

00:29:20.340 --> 00:29:21.180

partner bring to the

00:29:21.200 --> 00:29:22.741

relationship from some past

00:29:22.801 --> 00:29:24.122

encounter or some past

00:29:24.142 --> 00:29:25.203

trauma that's happened.

00:29:25.943 --> 00:29:28.245

So while it is important to

00:29:28.305 --> 00:29:30.406

be aware of red flags,

00:29:30.547 --> 00:29:31.787

it's also important to

00:29:31.827 --> 00:29:33.168

think about the idea that

00:29:34.269 --> 00:29:35.210

none of us come to a

00:29:35.250 --> 00:29:37.611

relationship perfectly whole, healed,

00:29:38.132 --> 00:29:39.092

and healthy.

00:29:39.913 --> 00:29:41.093

You know,

00:29:43.055 --> 00:29:44.396

we all have our issues that we're

00:29:44.416 --> 00:29:46.417

going to bring to the table and

00:29:47.268 --> 00:29:50.030

And I think that especially at this age,

00:29:50.070 --> 00:29:52.751

and you're younger than I am, but for me,

00:29:52.771 --> 00:29:54.192

when you're talking about a

00:29:54.292 --> 00:29:55.773

second primary relationship

00:29:55.833 --> 00:29:56.694

or you're talking about

00:29:56.854 --> 00:29:58.175

after a divorce or after a

00:29:58.235 --> 00:29:59.856

long-term relationship has ended,

00:30:01.137 --> 00:30:02.317

you're always going to

00:30:02.377 --> 00:30:03.758

bring some of that wounding

00:30:03.818 --> 00:30:04.879

to the new relationship

00:30:04.939 --> 00:30:06.180

unless you take your time

00:30:06.240 --> 00:30:08.741

to work through it and figure it out.

00:30:09.542 --> 00:30:11.523

So all of that just to say,

00:30:11.863 --> 00:30:13.504

we're talking about all these red flags,

00:30:13.544 --> 00:30:14.425

but it's also really

00:30:14.445 --> 00:30:15.666

important to recognize

00:30:16.666 --> 00:30:18.027

when a person is just trying

00:30:18.067 --> 00:30:18.847

to do their best.

00:30:19.007 --> 00:30:19.948

And for me,

00:30:20.248 --> 00:30:23.149

that looks like the ability to say, hey,

00:30:23.249 --> 00:30:24.870

I'm not sure exactly what happened,

00:30:25.510 --> 00:30:26.951

but here's how I'm feeling.

00:30:27.711 --> 00:30:28.832

And I'd really like to

00:30:28.872 --> 00:30:29.912

figure this out with you,

00:30:30.092 --> 00:30:32.834

as opposed to all of the

00:30:32.894 --> 00:30:34.815

red flag things like gaslighting,

00:30:35.295 --> 00:30:36.275

the silent treatment,

00:30:36.355 --> 00:30:38.016

passive aggressive actions.

00:30:38.717 --> 00:30:40.457

Those are the things that, you know,

00:30:40.597 --> 00:30:42.518

if you can come through a

00:30:46.400 --> 00:30:48.102

enacting some of these other

00:30:48.182 --> 00:30:49.443

passive aggressive actions,

00:30:49.463 --> 00:30:50.644

gaslighting and stuff like that,

00:30:50.684 --> 00:30:52.386

then that's probably not a

00:30:52.406 --> 00:30:53.687

relationship that's able to

00:30:53.727 --> 00:30:54.688

progress because you can't

00:30:54.728 --> 00:30:56.270

work through the conflict.

00:30:57.331 --> 00:30:58.312

Yeah, absolutely.

00:30:58.392 --> 00:31:01.435

And everyone is going to bring,

00:31:02.195 --> 00:31:04.818

I hate the word, but baggage, trauma.

00:31:05.098 --> 00:31:06.519

I mean, in a perfect world,

00:31:06.559 --> 00:31:07.180

we would all have

00:31:07.911 --> 00:31:09.012

gone through and healed our

00:31:09.052 --> 00:31:10.833

trauma and we can just jump

00:31:10.893 --> 00:31:12.655

right into a secure relationship,

00:31:12.695 --> 00:31:14.616

but that's just not the reality.

00:31:15.357 --> 00:31:16.698

And we all have different

00:31:17.098 --> 00:31:18.219

attachment styles.

00:31:19.380 --> 00:31:20.561

We have abandonment wounds.

00:31:20.581 --> 00:31:23.303

We all have different histories.

00:31:23.383 --> 00:31:24.264

We all have things that we

00:31:24.284 --> 00:31:25.945

went through and that we suffered from.

00:31:26.666 --> 00:31:28.747

And narcissism,

00:31:29.228 --> 00:31:29.728

people who have

00:31:30.108 --> 00:31:31.489

narcissistic tendencies or

00:31:31.529 --> 00:31:32.590

even the flat out disorder,

00:31:34.406 --> 00:31:35.508

they went through some stuff.

00:31:35.928 --> 00:31:38.532

And if it's unresolved,

00:31:39.653 --> 00:31:41.516

it's going to be really, really difficult,

00:31:41.596 --> 00:31:42.377

unfortunately.

00:31:42.658 --> 00:31:44.680

So, these, I think, are good ways to,

00:31:45.161 --> 00:31:45.401

you know,

00:31:45.421 --> 00:31:49.667

kind of test and see how they respond.

00:31:51.129 --> 00:31:51.649

Um,

00:31:51.669 --> 00:31:54.651

I did not know I had these things that

00:31:54.871 --> 00:31:56.252

I needed to resolve.

00:31:56.672 --> 00:31:59.733

I, I was clean and sober.

00:32:00.354 --> 00:32:01.614

I had a lot of breakthroughs

00:32:01.694 --> 00:32:03.055

and rehab and I had done a

00:32:03.195 --> 00:32:05.636

lot of internal work on myself.

00:32:05.656 --> 00:32:08.498

Um, but then jump, you know,

00:32:08.538 --> 00:32:09.819

getting into a relationship

00:32:09.839 --> 00:32:11.800

that it's a big mirror and

00:32:11.820 --> 00:32:14.221

a lot of things can pop up

00:32:14.421 --> 00:32:15.922

that if they're unresolved,

00:32:15.962 --> 00:32:18.423

they will show themselves for sure.

00:32:18.443 --> 00:32:18.543

Yeah.

00:32:18.803 --> 00:32:20.524

Yeah, definitely.

00:32:21.279 --> 00:32:23.941

So I guess just to kind of wrap up,

00:32:23.961 --> 00:32:24.641

and I don't know if you

00:32:24.681 --> 00:32:26.363

have additional things that

00:32:26.383 --> 00:32:27.684

you wanted to talk about, but.

00:32:28.378 --> 00:32:29.959

I think it's easy to look at

00:32:29.999 --> 00:32:32.560

the narcissistic traits and say like,

00:32:32.700 --> 00:32:34.220

okay, if somebody's gaslighting me,

00:32:34.400 --> 00:32:36.381

obviously that's a red flag.

00:32:36.781 --> 00:32:38.642

If somebody is grandiose,

00:32:38.742 --> 00:32:40.102

obviously that's a red flag.

00:32:41.183 --> 00:32:43.804

If somebody is making it all

00:32:43.844 --> 00:32:45.664

about them or if they're

00:32:45.724 --> 00:32:47.605

constantly needing validation, like those,

00:32:47.745 --> 00:32:49.186

obviously we know those

00:32:49.206 --> 00:32:50.186

things are red flags.

00:32:50.766 --> 00:32:51.927

I wanted to just talk about

00:32:52.187 --> 00:32:53.347

things that come up in a

00:32:53.407 --> 00:32:54.748

little more of a subtle way.

00:32:56.189 --> 00:32:57.350

The other point that I want

00:32:57.390 --> 00:32:59.151

to be sure to make is that

00:32:59.712 --> 00:33:00.913

no relationship is going to

00:33:00.933 --> 00:33:02.274

be without conflict.

00:33:02.914 --> 00:33:04.175

And so for me,

00:33:04.556 --> 00:33:06.057

the most important thing is

00:33:06.117 --> 00:33:08.099

how do you resolve conflict?

00:33:08.119 --> 00:33:09.240

How do you handle conflict?

00:33:09.280 --> 00:33:10.741

How do you repair afterwards?

00:33:11.562 --> 00:33:13.163

And do you have an ability

00:33:13.423 --> 00:33:15.625

to go through a conflict

00:33:15.665 --> 00:33:17.307

together and communicate in

00:33:17.347 --> 00:33:18.407

healthy ways about it?

00:33:19.308 --> 00:33:22.252

And I guess my two big,

00:33:22.312 --> 00:33:25.276

huge things are that I

00:33:25.316 --> 00:33:26.717

deserve to be treated with

00:33:26.757 --> 00:33:27.799

kindness and respect.

00:33:28.878 --> 00:33:31.019

even when we're in the middle of conflict.

00:33:31.659 --> 00:33:33.419

So if we're having a disagreement,

00:33:33.479 --> 00:33:34.620

if we're having a debate,

00:33:35.040 --> 00:33:35.840

if there's something we

00:33:35.900 --> 00:33:37.761

fundamentally just don't

00:33:37.821 --> 00:33:39.001

see eye to eye on,

00:33:39.441 --> 00:33:40.802

it's still possible for us

00:33:40.822 --> 00:33:41.882

to have a relationship.

00:33:42.442 --> 00:33:43.983

But in those disagreements,

00:33:44.103 --> 00:33:45.063

in those debates,

00:33:45.703 --> 00:33:46.643

am I being treated with

00:33:46.683 --> 00:33:47.704

kindness and respect?

00:33:47.804 --> 00:33:49.564

Am I being heard and understood?

00:33:49.604 --> 00:33:52.085

Do I feel validated by the

00:33:52.145 --> 00:33:53.646

person across the table

00:33:53.686 --> 00:33:55.746

from me in a way that makes

00:33:55.806 --> 00:33:57.547

me feel empowered to continue

00:33:58.287 --> 00:34:00.548

developing myself or do I

00:34:00.588 --> 00:34:03.289

feel like I'm having to avoid topics?

00:34:03.690 --> 00:34:04.710

Do I feel like I'm having to

00:34:04.750 --> 00:34:05.690

change the subject?

00:34:06.171 --> 00:34:07.531

Do I feel like I'm having to

00:34:07.611 --> 00:34:08.972

hide parts of myself or

00:34:09.012 --> 00:34:11.133

change parts of myself in

00:34:11.213 --> 00:34:13.154

order to fit into this relationship?

00:34:13.194 --> 00:34:13.994

So those are some of the

00:34:14.014 --> 00:34:15.355

things that I look for.

00:34:17.720 --> 00:34:18.981

Yeah, and that's really smart.

00:34:19.021 --> 00:34:21.422

If you're not able to be

00:34:21.462 --> 00:34:23.002

your full authentic self,

00:34:24.523 --> 00:34:25.723

then what are we doing?

00:34:25.903 --> 00:34:27.844

And I mean that with the

00:34:27.884 --> 00:34:28.944

most compassion ever

00:34:29.085 --> 00:34:29.965

because I've been there.

00:34:31.766 --> 00:34:33.566

I created a situation where

00:34:33.626 --> 00:34:35.267

my partner couldn't be her

00:34:35.307 --> 00:34:40.889

full authentic self and, you know, not –

00:34:39.690 --> 00:34:40.770

avoiding conflict or

00:34:40.810 --> 00:34:42.051

avoiding certain things or

00:34:42.111 --> 00:34:43.391

walking on eggshells or

00:34:43.431 --> 00:34:46.032

changing parts of her to

00:34:46.072 --> 00:34:49.272

accommodate me and that's

00:34:49.412 --> 00:34:50.493

that's not a great feeling

00:34:50.713 --> 00:34:52.893

you know but conflict

00:34:53.193 --> 00:34:54.834

resolution and being

00:34:54.934 --> 00:34:56.454

respectful and kind to each

00:34:56.494 --> 00:34:58.815

other during that like if

00:34:58.835 --> 00:35:00.695

you can go into an understanding like

00:35:02.540 --> 00:35:04.341

if they're willing to work on this,

00:35:04.441 --> 00:35:06.361

I'm willing to work with them, right?

00:35:06.982 --> 00:35:09.422

And I think that's so crucial.

00:35:09.763 --> 00:35:14.204

And instead of, you know,

00:35:15.084 --> 00:35:15.845

I've said this before,

00:35:16.125 --> 00:35:17.405

I really avoided shame.

00:35:17.445 --> 00:35:17.585

Like,

00:35:17.645 --> 00:35:20.426

I never wanted to admit or feel like

00:35:20.846 --> 00:35:22.807

I was the problem.

00:35:23.847 --> 00:35:25.008

And that goes back to a lot

00:35:25.048 --> 00:35:27.729

of my own self-esteem and

00:35:27.749 --> 00:35:29.069

being able to self-validate

00:35:29.169 --> 00:35:30.209

and self-love.

00:35:31.390 --> 00:35:31.550

So,

00:35:33.594 --> 00:35:35.236

Things to look out for maybe,

00:35:36.097 --> 00:35:37.098

and I hate to say this,

00:35:37.158 --> 00:35:39.020

but I think you really need to,

00:35:39.460 --> 00:35:41.782

is understand what their

00:35:41.822 --> 00:35:43.084

parent dynamic was like.

00:35:43.845 --> 00:35:45.426

How did their parents treat each other?

00:35:45.927 --> 00:35:47.048

Because I promise you,

00:35:47.088 --> 00:35:48.509

as much as I never wanted

00:35:48.549 --> 00:35:51.733

to become what I saw as

00:35:51.913 --> 00:35:54.756

negative parts of my parents or my dad,

00:35:56.053 --> 00:35:57.234

Even when I thought I was

00:35:57.274 --> 00:35:58.435

doing absolutely everything

00:35:58.495 --> 00:36:01.036

I possibly could not to be like that,

00:36:01.476 --> 00:36:02.797

it's kind of imprinted.

00:36:03.957 --> 00:36:05.338

It's almost through osmosis

00:36:06.179 --> 00:36:07.059

that that happens.

00:36:07.959 --> 00:36:12.162

And how did he treat his wife?

00:36:12.202 --> 00:36:13.102

Was there respect?

00:36:13.142 --> 00:36:15.243

What was their conflict resolution like?

00:36:15.323 --> 00:36:17.144

And I wish we had had these

00:36:17.184 --> 00:36:18.465

discussions before.

00:36:19.486 --> 00:36:20.687

with my previous partner and

00:36:20.727 --> 00:36:23.949

understanding like we avoided conflict,

00:36:23.989 --> 00:36:25.570

like the plague, you know,

00:36:25.610 --> 00:36:28.132

my dad wouldn't bring up an issue.

00:36:28.172 --> 00:36:31.214

He would just silent treatment or rage.

00:36:31.254 --> 00:36:32.134

And I always, you know,

00:36:32.254 --> 00:36:34.436

I'm thinking in my head, yeah, what a,

00:36:34.476 --> 00:36:35.096

what a jerk.

00:36:35.377 --> 00:36:38.879

How could you possibly do that?

00:36:38.899 --> 00:36:40.220

That can come up and you

00:36:40.260 --> 00:36:41.881

don't even want it to, you know,

00:36:42.742 --> 00:36:44.323

and you don't even want it to.

00:36:45.598 --> 00:36:45.918

Yeah,

00:36:46.078 --> 00:36:48.519

I think it's so easy to fall into

00:36:49.019 --> 00:36:50.659

what was modeled for us.

00:36:50.939 --> 00:36:52.419

So we have to give ourselves

00:36:52.499 --> 00:36:53.920

a lot of compassion and

00:36:53.960 --> 00:36:56.000

grace for the fact that if

00:36:56.060 --> 00:36:57.960

we didn't have a healthy

00:36:58.020 --> 00:37:00.861

model as a child of adults

00:37:01.761 --> 00:37:03.622

resolving conflict in healthy ways,

00:37:04.062 --> 00:37:05.042

we're obviously not going

00:37:05.062 --> 00:37:05.802

to know how to do it.

00:37:06.342 --> 00:37:07.162

So we have to teach

00:37:07.202 --> 00:37:08.122

ourselves how to do it.

00:37:08.162 --> 00:37:09.703

We have to learn by trial and error.

00:37:10.463 --> 00:37:10.663

And

00:37:11.543 --> 00:37:11.763

You know,

00:37:11.823 --> 00:37:13.504

I think what one of the things

00:37:13.524 --> 00:37:15.386

you said is really important to consider,

00:37:15.426 --> 00:37:17.807

like if this person wants to work on it,

00:37:18.368 --> 00:37:21.009

I will work on it with them.

00:37:21.069 --> 00:37:21.550

However,

00:37:21.610 --> 00:37:23.171

I'll put a little caveat in there

00:37:23.211 --> 00:37:23.631

as well.

00:37:25.052 --> 00:37:26.893

One of the things Dr. Romney says,

00:37:26.953 --> 00:37:28.714

and she's the narcissist expert,

00:37:29.875 --> 00:37:32.157

she says anyone can change.

00:37:32.797 --> 00:37:33.898

The narcissist won't.

00:37:35.039 --> 00:37:35.679

They don't think there's

00:37:35.699 --> 00:37:37.020

anything wrong with their behavior.

00:37:37.718 --> 00:37:39.339

So if you're working on

00:37:39.419 --> 00:37:41.279

something with your partner

00:37:41.999 --> 00:37:43.580

and you recognize the same

00:37:43.680 --> 00:37:45.260

patterns of behavior and

00:37:45.280 --> 00:37:46.481

the same cycles are coming

00:37:46.561 --> 00:37:47.801

up over and over again,

00:37:48.542 --> 00:37:50.262

there's your red flag right there.

00:37:50.782 --> 00:37:52.203

Because, yeah, I agree with you.

00:37:52.223 --> 00:37:53.383

Like if somebody else wants

00:37:53.403 --> 00:37:54.563

to work on the relationship,

00:37:54.764 --> 00:37:55.824

I want to work on it, too.

00:37:55.944 --> 00:37:58.525

It's a you know, it's a joint effort here.

00:37:59.405 --> 00:38:00.587

But if it gets to the point

00:38:00.707 --> 00:38:02.229

where they're breadcrumbing you,

00:38:02.309 --> 00:38:02.869

in other words,

00:38:02.889 --> 00:38:04.231

like just making just

00:38:04.271 --> 00:38:06.093

enough change to keep you hanging on,

00:38:06.794 --> 00:38:08.116

but then they go back to

00:38:08.156 --> 00:38:10.098

their same old patterns of relating again,

00:38:10.639 --> 00:38:12.060

those are red flags.

00:38:12.100 --> 00:38:13.622

So there is a point at which

00:38:13.662 --> 00:38:15.284

you have to assess the

00:38:15.805 --> 00:38:17.346

relationship in this situation and say,

00:38:17.386 --> 00:38:18.808

okay, have we been here before?

00:38:19.649 --> 00:38:20.529

Is this something that we've

00:38:20.549 --> 00:38:21.809

already worked on and we

00:38:21.849 --> 00:38:22.870

thought was going to change

00:38:23.090 --> 00:38:24.330

and now it's come up again?

00:38:25.130 --> 00:38:26.690

Or is this a new issue?

00:38:26.710 --> 00:38:28.290

We just always have to be

00:38:28.330 --> 00:38:29.411

relating or sorry,

00:38:29.491 --> 00:38:30.951

always have to be evaluating.

00:38:31.671 --> 00:38:32.811

Is this a cycle that's

00:38:32.871 --> 00:38:34.151

unhealthy that we're repeating?

00:38:34.772 --> 00:38:36.012

Or are we really working

00:38:36.052 --> 00:38:37.434

together for a solution?

00:38:37.833 --> 00:38:38.333

Exactly.

00:38:38.694 --> 00:38:41.234

And a more subtle thing that

00:38:41.294 --> 00:38:43.241

I think needs to be considered

00:38:43.711 --> 00:38:45.973

there can be accountability

00:38:46.313 --> 00:38:49.616

or like remorse or I'm so

00:38:49.696 --> 00:38:53.460

sorry and acknowledging that.

00:38:53.600 --> 00:38:55.341

And I hope that that doesn't

00:38:55.862 --> 00:38:57.563

immediately think in your head, okay,

00:38:57.944 --> 00:38:59.305

I can excuse them now

00:38:59.345 --> 00:39:00.206

because they're taking

00:39:00.246 --> 00:39:01.407

accountability and they've

00:39:01.467 --> 00:39:03.669

said they're sorry.

00:39:03.749 --> 00:39:03.909

Well,

00:39:05.943 --> 00:39:07.804

there has to be action, right?

00:39:08.084 --> 00:39:09.625

And I fell into this and I

00:39:09.665 --> 00:39:11.366

wanted to change and I wanted,

00:39:11.846 --> 00:39:14.727

and I truly was sorry, but there was,

00:39:15.448 --> 00:39:16.288

for whatever reason,

00:39:17.168 --> 00:39:19.469

there was maybe a little bread crumbing,

00:39:19.650 --> 00:39:19.930

right?

00:39:20.250 --> 00:39:20.370

Um,

00:39:21.228 --> 00:39:23.329

Because if you truly care

00:39:23.430 --> 00:39:24.570

and you have the space and

00:39:24.610 --> 00:39:27.372

you've healed your blocks and everything,

00:39:27.412 --> 00:39:29.314

then you will change for that person.

00:39:29.374 --> 00:39:30.475

You just will.

00:39:31.395 --> 00:39:33.176

And if they're not and they

00:39:33.237 --> 00:39:34.457

say all the right things,

00:39:34.617 --> 00:39:35.698

even in those difficult

00:39:35.738 --> 00:39:37.359

conversations and maybe

00:39:37.660 --> 00:39:39.621

they get emotional and they

00:39:39.661 --> 00:39:40.902

come up with excuses and

00:39:40.942 --> 00:39:43.724

they convince you that

00:39:44.263 --> 00:39:45.926

oh, maybe I was a little too hard,

00:39:46.907 --> 00:39:48.310

but nothing changes and

00:39:48.650 --> 00:39:49.752

you're having that cycle

00:39:49.812 --> 00:39:51.755

repeat itself and getting

00:39:51.795 --> 00:39:53.998

to a point where you don't

00:39:54.039 --> 00:39:55.962

even know if this cycle can be solved.

00:39:57.704 --> 00:39:58.765

that's still abuse.

00:39:59.085 --> 00:40:01.367

That's, that's basically lying, you know,

00:40:01.407 --> 00:40:01.967

and saying that,

00:40:02.147 --> 00:40:03.628

that you will change and

00:40:03.708 --> 00:40:05.329

there will be an improvement.

00:40:05.410 --> 00:40:06.250

And if there's not,

00:40:06.430 --> 00:40:07.491

that's also something you

00:40:07.531 --> 00:40:08.272

obviously have to,

00:40:08.852 --> 00:40:10.613

to look out for where that

00:40:10.653 --> 00:40:12.595

might not be as, as obvious.

00:40:13.015 --> 00:40:14.396

And it's not an outright,

00:40:14.496 --> 00:40:15.757

like you're calling me out.

00:40:15.797 --> 00:40:16.577

I'm defensive.

00:40:17.078 --> 00:40:17.918

It's a no.

00:40:17.998 --> 00:40:18.239

Okay.

00:40:18.259 --> 00:40:18.339

Yeah.

00:40:18.399 --> 00:40:19.740

You're I'm so sorry.

00:40:19.780 --> 00:40:20.480

I've been busy.

00:40:20.500 --> 00:40:22.862

Um, I will, I'll make this happen,

00:40:24.443 --> 00:40:25.644

but if nothing is changing,

00:40:27.514 --> 00:40:29.175

that's still something that

00:40:29.956 --> 00:40:33.699

you have to log, you know?

00:40:33.719 --> 00:40:35.441

Yeah, and I like that idea of logging.

00:40:35.661 --> 00:40:35.881

You know,

00:40:35.921 --> 00:40:37.562

it's like I'm not going to make a

00:40:37.602 --> 00:40:39.043

rash decision about a

00:40:39.083 --> 00:40:42.286

relationship just based on one single act,

00:40:42.486 --> 00:40:42.766

right?

00:40:42.947 --> 00:40:45.889

But I'm going to observe what's happening,

00:40:46.229 --> 00:40:47.150

and I'm going to take note,

00:40:47.390 --> 00:40:48.291

and I'm going to reserve

00:40:48.311 --> 00:40:50.633

that action for maybe a

00:40:50.673 --> 00:40:52.634

later time until I have more information.

00:40:52.674 --> 00:40:55.317

But each interaction informs

00:40:55.357 --> 00:40:56.838

our next interaction, I think.

00:40:58.099 --> 00:41:00.381

Yeah, absolutely, absolutely.

00:41:00.881 --> 00:41:03.103

And maybe a quick thing

00:41:03.143 --> 00:41:06.966

before we go is I would be

00:41:07.706 --> 00:41:09.428

cognizant and aware of,

00:41:10.168 --> 00:41:10.849

because a lot of our

00:41:10.909 --> 00:41:13.171

audience are former Mormons

00:41:13.231 --> 00:41:14.251

or they were raised in high

00:41:14.271 --> 00:41:18.034

control religions and so forth,

00:41:18.215 --> 00:41:19.395

if you're still pretty fresh

00:41:20.500 --> 00:41:22.181

of going through such a big

00:41:22.221 --> 00:41:24.882

change like that.

00:41:24.902 --> 00:41:25.602

For example,

00:41:25.982 --> 00:41:28.083

with rehab and overcoming that,

00:41:28.423 --> 00:41:30.304

they say don't get into a

00:41:30.364 --> 00:41:33.265

serious relationship for at least a year.

00:41:34.126 --> 00:41:36.647

And I would second that,

00:41:37.747 --> 00:41:38.647

whether you're still with

00:41:38.687 --> 00:41:40.908

your person or you've left

00:41:40.948 --> 00:41:41.789

the church and you want to

00:41:41.829 --> 00:41:42.649

get out there dating.

00:41:43.976 --> 00:41:45.616

I would just really caution

00:41:45.636 --> 00:41:47.437

you to figure out who you

00:41:47.537 --> 00:41:49.577

are a lot more and maybe

00:41:49.657 --> 00:41:50.677

uncover these things.

00:41:50.737 --> 00:41:52.518

Because from my experience,

00:41:52.698 --> 00:41:54.298

when you do it and you're

00:41:54.318 --> 00:41:55.578

in a committed relationship,

00:41:56.839 --> 00:41:58.599

it can be really, really hard.

00:41:58.839 --> 00:42:00.619

And there's certain things

00:42:00.659 --> 00:42:01.880

that you haven't been able

00:42:01.920 --> 00:42:02.840

to uncover yet.

00:42:04.000 --> 00:42:06.861

And that's why it's always

00:42:06.901 --> 00:42:07.861

good to take your time.

00:42:08.629 --> 00:42:09.730

So that's my little advice

00:42:09.770 --> 00:42:11.431

for maybe former Mormons or

00:42:11.491 --> 00:42:12.852

people who have just

00:42:12.892 --> 00:42:13.853

decided then they're

00:42:13.933 --> 00:42:17.336

heavily deconstructing to

00:42:17.376 --> 00:42:19.117

be careful because it's

00:42:19.217 --> 00:42:20.238

really exciting to find

00:42:20.278 --> 00:42:21.559

maybe like a non-Mormon or

00:42:21.599 --> 00:42:22.860

someone who has this

00:42:22.900 --> 00:42:23.901

different perspective and

00:42:23.941 --> 00:42:26.363

it is intoxicating and exciting,

00:42:26.443 --> 00:42:28.624

but you owe it to them and

00:42:28.645 --> 00:42:30.286

you owe it to yourself to

00:42:30.666 --> 00:42:32.788

take your time and learn to

00:42:32.808 --> 00:42:35.290

love yourself and learn this new you,

00:42:35.330 --> 00:42:35.630

you know?

00:42:37.260 --> 00:42:38.181

Yes, for sure.

00:42:38.301 --> 00:42:39.643

I think that's that's such a

00:42:39.683 --> 00:42:40.844

good point is that if

00:42:40.884 --> 00:42:42.926

you're deconstructing your

00:42:42.966 --> 00:42:44.028

entire worldview,

00:42:44.368 --> 00:42:45.489

you don't know who you are

00:42:45.529 --> 00:42:46.290

anymore right now.

00:42:47.712 --> 00:42:49.274

And if you don't know who you are,

00:42:49.414 --> 00:42:50.695

you can't really engage in

00:42:50.715 --> 00:42:51.856

a relationship in a healthy

00:42:51.896 --> 00:42:53.318

way because you're just

00:42:53.338 --> 00:42:54.740

going to be sort of sliding around.

00:42:54.800 --> 00:42:54.960

So.

00:42:56.481 --> 00:42:58.182

Dr. Romney actually says,

00:42:58.402 --> 00:42:59.663

if you're coming out of a

00:43:00.163 --> 00:43:02.445

narcissistic relationship,

00:43:02.905 --> 00:43:05.246

if you've been in an

00:43:05.366 --> 00:43:07.187

abusive narcissistic relationship,

00:43:07.247 --> 00:43:10.649

she says, take a full year, no flirting,

00:43:10.869 --> 00:43:13.831

no texting, no dating, no nothing.

00:43:13.951 --> 00:43:16.892

Take a full year, meet yourself again,

00:43:17.673 --> 00:43:19.214

and then re-engage.

00:43:19.294 --> 00:43:20.935

And I totally agree with that.

00:43:21.755 --> 00:43:22.255

Um,

00:43:22.375 --> 00:43:24.016

I think when you're deconstructing

00:43:24.076 --> 00:43:25.837

religion, it can be like you say,

00:43:25.898 --> 00:43:26.998

really tempting to like

00:43:27.058 --> 00:43:27.919

jump into a new

00:43:27.959 --> 00:43:29.139

relationship with somebody

00:43:29.179 --> 00:43:31.541

who is the opposite of who

00:43:31.581 --> 00:43:34.783

you would have chosen in your old life.

00:43:34.983 --> 00:43:35.223

Right.

00:43:36.365 --> 00:43:38.606

Um, but there again, if your,

00:43:38.906 --> 00:43:40.806

if your worldview is majorly changing,

00:43:40.846 --> 00:43:42.207

then you don't know who you are yet.

00:43:42.427 --> 00:43:43.687

And it's so important to,

00:43:44.427 --> 00:43:45.647

to sort of have some

00:43:45.707 --> 00:43:47.208

foundational boundaries and

00:43:47.308 --> 00:43:48.888

some foundational values

00:43:49.248 --> 00:43:50.869

that you choose for yourself.

00:43:51.389 --> 00:43:52.629

But it's important to know

00:43:52.669 --> 00:43:54.130

what those are before you

00:43:54.170 --> 00:43:55.210

go out there in the world

00:43:55.350 --> 00:43:57.711

and start interacting with other people,

00:43:58.111 --> 00:43:59.191

especially attaching to

00:43:59.251 --> 00:44:00.211

other people when you have

00:44:00.331 --> 00:44:02.292

no idea how that's going to

00:44:02.312 --> 00:44:03.232

affect them or you.

00:44:04.718 --> 00:44:05.039

Yeah.

00:44:05.299 --> 00:44:06.901

And with all this

00:44:06.941 --> 00:44:08.963

deconstruction you're doing, you know,

00:44:09.944 --> 00:44:10.845

an example of leaving the

00:44:10.885 --> 00:44:12.627

church is now you have this huge,

00:44:13.088 --> 00:44:14.109

we'll call it a void,

00:44:15.030 --> 00:44:16.412

that you now get to fill

00:44:16.452 --> 00:44:17.473

with learning to love

00:44:17.493 --> 00:44:18.734

yourself and learning who you are.

00:44:18.754 --> 00:44:18.955

Yeah.

00:44:20.296 --> 00:44:22.218

there's no need for dating

00:44:22.278 --> 00:44:24.560

or any of that um just just

00:44:24.700 --> 00:44:26.761

learn about yourself fill

00:44:26.781 --> 00:44:28.283

fill this void fill this

00:44:28.403 --> 00:44:30.244

new found space you have in

00:44:30.264 --> 00:44:32.286

your soul and and fill it

00:44:32.306 --> 00:44:33.407

with with figuring out

00:44:33.427 --> 00:44:35.008

things you love or figuring

00:44:35.048 --> 00:44:36.169

out things that you want to

00:44:36.209 --> 00:44:37.370

work on yourself like

00:44:37.710 --> 00:44:38.651

there's all the time in the

00:44:38.691 --> 00:44:41.493

world for that and um that

00:44:41.573 --> 00:44:42.914

that would be my advice

00:44:42.954 --> 00:44:44.175

because i i think i i

00:44:45.281 --> 00:44:47.923

I jumped in too quickly and

00:44:50.244 --> 00:44:51.064

it wasn't a good thing.

00:44:51.405 --> 00:44:52.265

And I wish I hadn't.

00:44:52.705 --> 00:44:53.906

I wish I had taken more time.

00:44:55.989 --> 00:44:56.209

Yeah.

00:44:56.550 --> 00:44:58.351

Well, that is great advice.

00:44:59.132 --> 00:45:00.353

Thank you so much for

00:45:00.713 --> 00:45:01.854

unpacking this with me.

00:45:02.275 --> 00:45:03.096

I think this is going to be

00:45:03.116 --> 00:45:04.677

really helpful to a lot of people.

00:45:05.318 --> 00:45:06.539

I think a lot of people are

00:45:06.599 --> 00:45:08.741

scared of the dating scene

00:45:08.761 --> 00:45:09.802

because they're scared of

00:45:10.062 --> 00:45:11.463

encountering a narcissist

00:45:11.523 --> 00:45:13.505

and maybe not knowing what to do.

00:45:13.585 --> 00:45:15.166

So hopefully this gives

00:45:15.226 --> 00:45:16.508

people a little bit of a

00:45:16.568 --> 00:45:17.829

framework of little things

00:45:17.849 --> 00:45:18.910

to start looking out for.

00:45:18.990 --> 00:45:20.751

Nobody needs to do anything drastic.

00:45:21.752 --> 00:45:24.334

right now, you know, just small,

00:45:24.514 --> 00:45:26.095

small little things to look

00:45:26.175 --> 00:45:28.857

out for little changes and, you know,

00:45:29.297 --> 00:45:32.660

little tiny, you know, tiny movements,

00:45:32.720 --> 00:45:33.840

not drastic actions.

00:45:34.541 --> 00:45:34.721

Yeah.

00:45:34.761 --> 00:45:36.082

This is an exciting time

00:45:36.122 --> 00:45:37.703

where a lot of shifts are happening.

00:45:37.883 --> 00:45:41.426

And so enjoy the shift with,

00:45:41.526 --> 00:45:42.526

with yourself and

00:45:42.566 --> 00:45:44.368

discovering that and friends and,

00:45:44.608 --> 00:45:45.368

and growth.

00:45:45.468 --> 00:45:47.350

And, and then, you know,

00:45:47.370 --> 00:45:48.831

you trust in the universe.

00:45:48.871 --> 00:45:50.172

If you're, if you're doing what you should,

00:45:50.332 --> 00:45:50.572

you'll,

00:45:51.683 --> 00:45:54.165

Everything will, you'll get who you need.

00:45:54.185 --> 00:45:56.207

You'll get what your heart desires.

00:45:56.827 --> 00:45:58.809

And there's just, there's no rush.

00:45:58.909 --> 00:46:00.310

And I think after the

00:46:00.350 --> 00:46:01.631

deconstruction part and all

00:46:01.671 --> 00:46:04.453

of this awakening is really,

00:46:04.493 --> 00:46:05.954

really fun to be able to

00:46:06.014 --> 00:46:08.016

just focus in on yourselves

00:46:08.056 --> 00:46:09.557

and do things like this and

00:46:09.597 --> 00:46:10.778

find new hobbies and

00:46:11.378 --> 00:46:12.799

discover things you never

00:46:12.859 --> 00:46:13.980

would have before because

00:46:14.000 --> 00:46:14.961

you have an entire new

00:46:15.001 --> 00:46:16.042

world to go explore.

00:46:16.854 --> 00:46:17.094

Yeah.

00:46:17.354 --> 00:46:17.534

Yeah.

00:46:17.554 --> 00:46:18.114

It's exciting.

00:46:18.655 --> 00:46:20.195

Remind us one more time what

00:46:20.235 --> 00:46:22.136

your Instagram and TikTok handle is.

00:46:23.216 --> 00:46:24.616

Awakening expansion.

00:46:24.916 --> 00:46:28.111

So awakening underscore expansion.

00:46:28.418 --> 00:46:29.559

YouTube is awakening

00:46:29.619 --> 00:46:33.140

expansion and Instagram is as well.

00:46:33.160 --> 00:46:34.560

All right.

00:46:34.600 --> 00:46:34.800

Well,

00:46:34.900 --> 00:46:36.921

I'm really excited to see more of

00:46:36.941 --> 00:46:38.101

what you're going to do online.

00:46:38.221 --> 00:46:39.301

And thanks as always for

00:46:39.461 --> 00:46:41.382

being so generous with your time.

00:46:42.429 --> 00:46:44.115

Of course, Megan, always a pleasure.

00:46:44.677 --> 00:46:48.049

And we will chat soon.

00:46:48.169 --> 00:46:48.902

All right, take care.